KapoK gas roaster

[9Sbeans]

Quick update of the High/Low charge temp results.

To my surprise, the wife and I both preferred the high charge temperature (362F) roasting results.  The low charge temperature roasting (300F) yielded a very nice cup in every aspect, but the high CT was even more exciting.  High CT was an obvious winner in both Aeropress and SO espresso.  I’ll compare their peak and decay rates, but more likely they will be gone soon and I won’t see them decay. 
It should be noted that this wet-processed Kenya Peaberry scored 92.9 in Sweet Maria’s, and SM suggested it for both drip and SO espresso.  I won’t extrapolate this one-time experiment to other beans.

[9Sbeans]

Roasting Info:

Bean: Ethiopia Gedeo Yirga Cheffe
Roaster: KapoK 500 sample roaster
Charge Mass: 227 g
Charge Temp: 300.9F
Dry/Ramp/Development: 5:02/4:56/2:41
FC-start temp: 375.6F
Finish Temp: 396.9F
Overall Roast Time: 12:39
Moisture Loss: 14.1%

Here is an example of low (300F) CT profiles.  This Ethiopia was aimed for city+, Aeropress in my office.  I tweaked the timing of the power adjustment, and used the fan after the 1st crack to slow down the RoR.  Compare the RoR of BT of this plot (300F CT) and the previous plot (360F CT), actually the maximum RoR were both close to 38F/min.  Lower charge temperature has lower turning point temperature, but spent longer time in the Drying phase, hence similar maximum RoR.  The averaged 7.9F/min vs. 10.7F/min development phase could be due to my more aggressive increased of fan speed.  I could make the RoR as low as 5F/min without stalling. 
Again, the KapoK 500 roaster is good, the controlling of it is easy, and the reproducibility is so far so good.  As to the roasting profiles and tastes correlations, I have a big Huh to myself.   

[Javadive]

I notice that they have North America office, is it chaper to order directly?

[9Sbeans]

I notice that they have North America office, is it chaper to order directly?

I tried to contact them via several different e-mail addresses, but end up reached the same person, Mr. Lin the owner.  I don’t think they have an office in NA as of now.  Anyway, bargaining with him was easier, no middle man. 

[mp]

Hey 9Sbeans ... you really need to stop it with this roaster porn.

People have only so much will power to use to try to not to be tempted by it.

 

[9Sbeans]

Sure this will be my conclude post of this thread, unless I need to address something or answer any question. 

Last year I tried to negotiate a group buy with Mr. Lin, but he refused.  The UPS air freight shipping was about $1250.  Trying to “split the shipping cost” was asking for 10% discount, and a “free shipping” inquiry was the same as asking for 20%-off.  Anyhow, it is a big ticket item, worth pondering, and window shopping is always fun. 

I should list three features I like the most, and three things I wish could have been better.
Pro.
1. Safety features, all mentioned in earlier posts.  It also has dedicated compartments separating electric board and gas line to reduce the risk of spark-ignited fire in case of gas leakage.
2. Multi-steps of power/fan controls   After several batches, I really appreciate the fine controls I could have.  (I don’t have hand-on experience of other gas roaster, therefore cannot compare the “touch” and adjustment levels.)
3. Auto-BT temperature control   I really like the convenient, and this function had saved me a lot of time. 
The stylish outlook is a big bonus for WAF (wife acceptance factor), but not a deal breaker for me.  Some of the artisan coffee shops in Taiwan install big, shiny glass window to have their roast masters showing off, and a piece of eye candy is always the focus.  I’m not that into it though.

Con.
1. It is not ETL/UL approved as of now.   Mr. Lin said the machine uses only certified components, and he is on his way to get the whole roaster approved.   
2. No vendor in North America as of now.   I was lucky, no shipping damage, working out of the box.  A vendor could have provided better service, faster responses for inquiries, technical/repair supports, etc.   
3. Longevity unknown   For a commercial roaster lightly used in a household setting, I expect at least 10-years of worry-free usage.  I believe mechanically it will hold up, but not so sure about the electronic bells and whistles.  Only time will tell.   

[Joe]

Nice looking roaster. I saw something similar in the Taipei Airport when I went through there it was a Lysander. I was thinking about contacting them about exclusive North American Rights

[hankua]

That's a re-branded Turkish roaster.

[Joe]

That's a re-branded Turkish roaster.

Interesting I was wondering why no one had been mentioning them. They were in the airport, I was surprised. Is it an Ozturk?

[hankua]

I'm not sure, that company is not a major player in the Taiwan roasting scene. Taiwan is a major world class manufacturing country and there are numerous domestic roasters available not to mention the big boys. Even Loring has a small footprint, Probat of course.

China being the manufacturing powerhouse will probably overtake Turkey supplying the budget/economy market. They have a glut of steel, and underutilized/oversupply of industry that can easily produce coffee roasters.

Coffee Crafters maker of the Artisan V6 is coming out with a small fluid bed machine; and new streamlined manufacturing production line.

[Joe]

Maybe, I could see that happening if companies in China had staying power. I haven't seen as much long term "stick and stay and make it pay" Chinese roaster manufacturers. We will see I guess.

The rust belt seems to be getting attractive for manufacturing again. Seeing the local fabricated roasters in Thailand doing great makes me think this might start happening more often.

[hankua]

That would be awesome, building a coffee roaster is really old school technology.

[9Sbeans]

Look at my own ugly roasting profiles from last year, yikes; I knew nothing about roasting at the time. 

Funny that Joe revived this old thread.  Couple days ago I just replied a PM from a Canadian member about my updated opinion.  Simply put, I still love my roaster.  Throughout some discussions in several roasting forums, I gradually realized the value of unique features of KapoK.  No, I don’t want to start a war arguing who get the biggest-baddest-arse toy, and will keep some opinions to myself. 

Here are some of the minor issues I have experienced with the KapoK roaster, and I think should also be shared in public (in addition to the PM).

1. Noisy when the machine is cold (below 75*C; 170*F). Powering up the roaster automatically starts the drum rotation, and it is suggested to gradually warming up the machine to 180*C (360*F) in 15 mins. At the end of the day’s roast session, it is also suggested to cool down the drum until below 75*C before switching off the power. It’s a bit noisy during the above warming-up and cooling-down procedure. The drum is double-walled (outer wall cast iron, inner wall 304 food grade stainless steel) and the body of the machine is made from composite material. I suspect different thermal expansion coefficients of different metals are the culprit. I keep the roaster in the un-insulated garage and in the winter it could be as low as 0*F. The extreme temperature fluctuation might exacerbate the issue. In the user’s manual it says the drum has been carefully aligned while at 200*C (400*F) working temperature. User can perform the alignment, but not recommended. I didn’t bother to align the drum myself, because it’s very quiet at working temperature.

2. In early days, I observed occasional BT spikes in Artisan. At the time of purchasing the machine, Frank told me that they have tested the Artisan compatibility and suggested me to stay at version 0.6 instead of upgrading to 0.7. I installed Artisan 0.70 anyway and experienced spikes. I haven’t changed any hardware configuration, but vaguely remember after upgrading to v0.7.4 or above the spiking issue disappeared. I couldn’t reproduce the spiking and wouldn’t know this is hardware grounding or the software compatibility issue.

3. There is an automatic electrical gas valve in the roaster. When the automatic mode is engaged, the gas valve can quickly switch between high and low gas pressure mode to maintain the user defined temperature. I once fired up the roaster in very cold weather (5*F; -15*C). I left the garage door fully open and after one batch of roast the electrical gas valve was "frozen" (in my guess) at low pressure position. I had to stop my session, and the next warmer day the roaster was functional as usual.

[9Sbeans]

I haven’t contacted the owner of KapoK, Frank, for over one year because I don’t have any hardware or software issue.  I spent most of my time surfing through internet learning various roasting styles and tried to mimic those styles on my roaster.  Only couple days ago it brought to my attention that the official KapoK website is gone. 

Have they gone belly up and out of business?

I quickly checked and found their FaceBook page.  Apparently last week (4/23-24) they just sponsored a roasting competition, and the champion could win a KapoK 1-kg roaster (at least US$12,000 value).  They spent more than 5 hours to calibrate 4 of the 1-kg roasters in the contest (which is their standard procedure for every manufactured product), and these roasters kept running 8+hrs a day without any issue.

Frank is fastidious owner, and the expensive price tag implies very low volume moved.  I really don’t know how the workers make for their livings.  They might make products other than coffee roasters.  I also found Jacky Lai’s Facebook page (he is the WCE 2014 roasting champion), and he disclosed that, Frank didn’t sell any roaster for whole 8 years because Frank himself was not satisfied with the roaster and kept tweaking the design.  According to Jacky Lai, there are more than 3000 micro-roasteries in Taiwan and more young people jumping in.  A chicken in every pot, a coffee roaster in every garage? 

Although more and more world-wide manufacturers relocated to China seeking cheaper labor in the past twenty years, there are still many satellite factories (such as Toyota and Honda) staying in Taiwan for more precision products.  An interesting hearsay, Frank has two policies: Taiwan-first and no-China.  He would choose materials and parts (as simple as bolt and nut) made in Taiwan before out-sourcing, and try to prevent/minimize any product containing parts made in China.  Just another interesting hearsay. 

[Joe]

I was looking for an appropriate place to talk about the lysander roaster i saw in Taipei. I knew I'd smoke you and Hank out talking about your Taiwan Roasters