Sonofresco / Q&A / Tip & Tricks

[rfeuker]

Bob,

My understanding is that voltage at your location can play a role in the setting you need to set to get the results you want, and the Temp sensor comes into play. If the sensor is older, slightly dirty, etc., then it will also effect the setting needed. I will admit I prefer lighter roasts on most greens. Sometimes I do go to #5 on a Sumatra, espresso roast, etc., but generally I'm at #4.....

BTW, THANK YOU for roasting for the troops!!!!!!!!!!!!! 40# went to the combat zone to 8 different units 10 days ago. I just got confirmation that one has gotten there! Coffee for Christmas!!!! jim

I'm pretty sure my voltage is ok. Not so confident in the sensor though.  The whole roaster was pretty dirty.  I soaked all of the removal parts (excluding the sensor) in Cafiza overnight and still had to apply some Barkeeper's Friend and elbow grease to some parts.

Are you suggesting that I should see a bigger difference between setting 5 and setting 6 (assuming good voltage etc.), and/or that setting 6 would generally be pretty dark?  The sensor looked a little tan.  I used some ceramic stove top cleaner my wife had and gently cleaned it with a Scotch Brite.  It cleaned up a little but doesn't sparkle.  I'm reluctant to treat it too rough, it does seem fragile.

[jspain]

Be VERY CAREFUL with the sensor!!! NO MOISTURE AT ALL!

I don't believe I'm suggesting anything. You probably are "right on" and just like a darker roast than I? I don't think you'll see a GREAT difference from any one setting to the next. They are small increments from my experience,

My guess is your good to go. Have a blast!  Jim

[milowebailey]

Bob

Per sonofresco I wouldn't use cleaners on the sensor.  If it's not caked with oils and goo then leave it be.  You'll know if it's gone bad... you'll get an error.   Because this is a fluid bed roaster yours profile may differ slightly than other folks due to the air flow differences and the gas valve, jet differences.  As long as you are getting consistent results you'll be fine.  One of the biggest complaints I had with the Sono is you are stuck with the pre-programmed profile.

Accumulation of dirt on the temperature sensor will insulate the sensor and will cause the roast to become darker
at a given setting.
• The sensor is located at the top of the smoke box assembly and should be cleaned by gently scrapping the ceramic
portion of the sensor with the edge of a knife as shown in figure 5. Be sure to support the end of the sensor
to prevent damage to the wires due to excessive movement.
• The smoke box assembly should be maintained to
avoid build-up of dust and oils. If allowed to
build-up, the oils will become baked on to the surface
and will become difficult to remove.
• A dirty smoke box will cause the roast to become
darker at a given setting.
• Clean the smoke box assembly weekly with warm
soap and water and a semi-abrasive pad such as
scotchbrite, figure 6.
• A well maintained assembly, as seen
in figure 7, is the key to quality roasting
and a long lasting trouble free
machine.
TEMPERATURE SENSOR AND SMOKE BOX ASSEMBLY
Smoke box assembly
Temperature sensor
Note: Figures 5-7 are viewed from underneath the chaff collector assembly, figure 4 is viewed from above.
CAUTION: The temperature sensor is delicate and should be handled with care.
Clean only the ceramic end of the sensor, do not touch the wires. It is also important
not to move the sensor from it’s location shown in figure 4 where the tip of
the sensor is offset from the center of the smoke box by approximately 0.5 in.

[rfeuker]

Thanks for the feedback guys, I do tend to worry needlessly.  I'm fat and happy; can't wait to do some for my own use tomorrow.

[Joe]

if you use anything besides a dry scotch brite your sensor is now useless and will not roast right. You will get darker roasts even at levels of 2 or 1. This isn't from it getting caked with goo. In fact after over cleaning one with regular dry scotch brite pads I had one go bad. This is a $75 lesson unfortunately as all parts on the sono are not cheap. My recommendation is to leave the thermocouple alone and clean it with a dry scotch brite once a month at most.

Joe

[ScareYourPassenger]

If it is really caked with junk they told me to use 200 grit sandpaper. Worked great on mine!

[rfeuker]

if you use anything besides a dry scotch brite your sensor is now useless and will not roast right. You will get darker roasts even at levels of 2 or 1. This isn't from it getting caked with goo. In fact after over cleaning one with regular dry scotch brite pads I had one go bad. This is a $75 lesson unfortunately as all parts on the sono are not cheap. My recommendation is to leave the thermocouple alone and clean it with a dry scotch brite once a month at most.

Joe

Or not.
"Useless" seems a little extreme.  The sensor appears to be far from useless.  It shuts off the gas appropraitely and finally stops  the blower as well.  My roasts have not been dark, if anything they look a little light to me.  I really thing it's fine.  It's not like I used some abrasive element on it (like 200 grit sand paper) for crying out loud.  It was a pinky finger worth of ceramic cooktop cleaner that I gently and thoroughly wiped off after application.

[rfeuker]

Ok, I've done about 12 pounds in my new Sono and I really like it.  It's really nice to dump in 20 oz. of green, set the profile, and let 'er rip.  Still working on finding the "right" profile(s) for me.  I've only done two types of beand that I've kept - the Harar offered here a short time ago and a Guat from Nov.  Looking like 4 works in Africa and 5 in Central America so far.  Just experimented today with an espresso blend.  Brazil 60% and Guat 40% roasted together.  Used setting "7" and the results look and smell good.  I'll be using it for some Christmas fou fou drinks mostly.  Long-term this could get to be a problem for me.  That 1+ pound is more than I normally use in two weeks. 


A couple of questions/observations:
1.  The Harar seemed to need more rest (about 4 days versus 2) to get to its full flavor than the same bean done in my Behmor.  Is this typical?  Should I plan on a longer de-gassing with the fluid bed roaster than the drum.
2.  I vented the roaster to the outside and have great difficulty hearing first crack, and have never heard 2nd - probably a function of 64 years and too much rock and roll as a young man.  I've never used a thermocouple, but would putting one in the beans (a la tex) mean not hearing cracks is no problem?  Some here have said that's a waste of time since Sono has one already.  Can I just rely on monitoring that air temp and assuming a reading of 205 (or whatever) is consistent?

[jspain]

Bob,

I can't really say I have seen a great difference from my Behmor to the Sono with rest periods. I do agree that the Harrar needs 4 days rest regardless of which roaster I roast it in..... I have some beans that respond best at 8 days rest. I have not seen a difference from one roaster to another as it relates to rest.

I can't answer question #2. I do hear the cracks when I pay attention, however with the Sono I set, and let her rip. When I roast a green for the first time I will "sometimes" cut the gas and stop the roast if "I think" it's gone far enough. I don't use a thermocouple thus can't relate.

Nothing beats experience and experimentation. After 2 years on my 2#er it's "almost" automatic.....  jim

[Tex]

What non-Sono users don't get is the Sono has just one profile. The only thing the programs do is change the final temp.

As for using a temp probe in the beans; I'm still trying to find the correlation between bean mass temp readings and the roast levels I want. I placed a probe in the beans because the stock probe after the chaff trap doesn't respond fast enough to temp changes at 2nd crack - but then I'm not sure the bean mass probe I put in does either? That's what I'm working on determining.

The problem is, I don't roast frequently enough to make accurate readings. If I was cranking out batch after batch it'd be easier to figure it all out.

edited: I'm hard of hearing too (too many years shooting competitively does that), so I have a hard time hearing 1st crack, much less 2nd. I'm considering whether to get a small microphone that I can stick on the glass roasting chamber to amplify the sound.

[jimbo]

So, I've roasted about 10 lbs on my new-to-me Sono 1# (purchased from mattquist, a great guy to deal with.)

Roasted Costa Rica Cerro Paldo from Klatch.  (First purchase from them, and another good transaction.)

I am really liking this thing.  Changes the way I roast a bit.  I can hear 1st crack, but 2nd is pretty elusive. 

Larger batches, and quicker than my old model digital Hottop and my Behmor. 

Life is good.

[1981er]

Hey Jimbo, what setting did you use for the Costa Cerro Paldo? 

After 30 something roasts on the Sono, I've noticed that often times when entering/ beginning to roll in 1st crack, the gas will cycle off and watching my external TC (fitting right by the SF's sensor) the temp will drop almost 20 degrees before the gas fires back on and 1c resumes/ finishes.  This gets me worried about stalling/ baking and having 1c drag on too long.  Anyone experienced this?

[ScareYourPassenger]

Hey Jimbo, what setting did you use for the Costa Cerro Paldo? 

After 30 something roasts on the Sono, I've noticed that often times when entering/ beginning to roll in 1st crack, the gas will cycle off and watching my external TC (fitting right by the SF's sensor) the temp will drop almost 20 degrees before the gas fires back on and 1c resumes/ finishes.  This gets me worried about stalling/ baking and having 1c drag on too long.  Anyone experienced this?

I haven't watched the temp but none of my roasts go longer than 4 min 1st to 2nd crack.

I roasted the Cerro Paldo to full city a couple weeks ago as well. A total duration of 10:44 and 1st crack hit at 6:57.  A nice coffee that really blew away the Kenyan from Klatch I roasted last week.

[jimbo]

Hey Jimbo, what setting did you use for the Costa Cerro Paldo? 

After 30 something roasts on the Sono, I've noticed that often times when entering/ beginning to roll in 1st crack, the gas will cycle off and watching my external TC (fitting right by the SF's sensor) the temp will drop almost 20 degrees before the gas fires back on and 1c resumes/ finishes.  This gets me worried about stalling/ baking and having 1c drag on too long.  Anyone experienced this?

I starting out using #6, and killing the gas.  I need to really do some experimentation with the settings, but I've always been very much hands on, relying more on  my senses than on a program to tell me when the beans were done.  Struggling to hear 2nd crack makes that more challenging.

With my Hottop it has been sound, smell, sight (in that order.)  With the Behmor it has been mostly sound.  On both 99% of the time I stop the roast before the program finished.

Jimbo

[Tex]

I use a  type K thin wire, beaded-end thermocouple that I loop over the glass and suspend ~3" from the bottom of the roast chamber. With this setup I can judge the bean mass temps - much more accurate than environmental temps.

I used this in milo's Sono and recorded the temps of each roast - but like a dummy I tossed my notes when I sold the roaster. Now I'm beginning to build my notes again, so I should be able to roast just by temp.

To my mind this is the only way to go with a Sono. The glass gets smudgy, so you can't depend on color. The noise level is such that 2nd crack is tough to monitor.