Green Coffee Buying Club
Coffee Discussion boards => Hardware & Equipment => Topic started by: sea330 on May 27, 2015, 07:42:36 AM
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Interesting
http://ksyuanhan.en.alibaba.com/product/60079748331-222097954/abc.html?err_biz_type=null&url_type=pro_mini_pic_url_1&biz_type=Ta_latest_info&crm_mtn_tracelog_task_id=6c65aad6-8b5f-4a3f-ba4e-f6f22a9c976c&crm_mtn_tracelog_log_id=5917852078 (http://ksyuanhan.en.alibaba.com/product/60079748331-222097954/abc.html?err_biz_type=null&url_type=pro_mini_pic_url_1&biz_type=Ta_latest_info&crm_mtn_tracelog_task_id=6c65aad6-8b5f-4a3f-ba4e-f6f22a9c976c&crm_mtn_tracelog_log_id=5917852078)
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So many people have been scammed in Alibaba that I deter from it.
Pat
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Good to know Monito, I ordered a item about a year ago threw them, process went with out a hitch. I have been looking for a moisture tester, may go a head and get this one, can't beat the price.
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sea330 - did you ever order this one ?
I have a need for such a moisture tester but .... never bought via alibaba and their ads always look frighteningly cheesie.
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this is a vendor you can get one http://www.farmcomp.fi/en/wile/products/wile-for-grain/wile-55 (http://www.farmcomp.fi/en/wile/products/wile-for-grain/wile-55)
I haven't ordered it yet, still thinking.
Cheers
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sea, Im not seeing where you can actually order one from that website. It has info about the products but no ordering page unless Im going senile.
I was thinking of contacting them, there are several questions Id like to ask them. If there is an interest AND they would do it, I could pick up a number of them to sell to the club members. I don't even know what it costs though so can't commit to anything but it does look interesting.
Honestly though, for those of us who are not uber nerd dweeby types, what would telling us the moisture content in the beans actually allow us to do, beside add more columns to our data reams? Wow it has 12 percent instead of 7 percent i need to let it dry for an extra 10 seconds?
Aaron
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Sorry for the multiple post but....
Alibaba's description .vs. when you go to the actual companies website which is in Finland, is a bit different on the model number.
On the companies website, it lists specific meters for specific things, and coffee is a separate category.
On AliBaba, they are notorious for generalizing, ie they love to use a ton of 'keywords' to get you to their page, then its up to you to try to figure out if that product is what you wanted or not.
Manufacturer -
We have a meter, it has 7 different 'setups' or models, and can measure moisture in 65 different mediums. Choose what you want to measure moisture in and then get the correct model for your specific product.
Alibaba - We have a meter that measures moisture in 65 different mediums, only 140 dollars! You go now!!
Be careful when dealing with them, KNOW the exact specs of what you want and the exact model number. Don't trust their write up that it's what you really want.
Aaron
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You can get an idea on moisture content, a rough idea, by measuring volume and then weighing. More weight in the same volume tells you more moisture. Different beans would have to be roughly the same size. I'd say for most of us, that would get you close enough, at least in the ballpark.
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Some beans are denser than others, not necessarily water weight either. Smaller beans would appear more 'dense / watery' because they would take up the same volume in a container yet weigh more because they are able to be packed in tighter. The only real way to tell volume displaced would be to displace water and measure it. That might make them have a little bit more moisture content in them :D Id recommend using very hot water, that way when you are done figuring out the volume, you can have some coffee-tea to sip on.
Aaron
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Hmm - you can actually measure moisture by weighing before and after tossing some beans in a low oven for a couple hours.
But Aaron's right - the density of the actual bean matter varies a lot. I had some big Mex beans a few years ago that were very low density (and not very good) and then some of the small funky-shaped beans (ethiop or yemeni) seem far more dense than a typical C/S American arabica. Then we get to the issue of the bean size having an effect on the gap volume.
I really want the device to measure grain moisture, but coffee is a plus too.
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I just purchased a grain moisture tester on eBay to try out on coffee. I think that the calibration is the critical factor on whether this works on corn, or soy beans, or whatever you have...but you have to calibrate using a known sample of the target grain/bean/seed. I bought this for the ridiculous price of $14.00 plus shipping. It is not new, and sold for around $200.00 new. I put some greens I had laying around, and I got a reading of 12%. This could be right, or it could be wrong. I wouldn't know because I don't have a control sample. Anybody know where I can buy greens of a known moisture content? Would love to see my $14.00 investment pay off ;D!
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Well if you ground them up and brewed them, I am guessing the moisture content would be extremely close to 100 percent right? :D
Aaron
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Shocking!! :o Should I roast them first Aaron ::)?? LOL
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Actually isn't there a green coffee - tea .... whatever you want to call it...out there made from soaking green beans?
But YES you have to roast them first, you have to drive all the moisture out of them before you re hydrate them so you don't accidentally go over 100 percent moisture in them.
Finding a sample with a set moisture content I thing may be a bit difficult to keep the content at a set level. Id think you'd have to control atmospheric pressure, temperature and some other factors too. What happens over time with cellular breakdown, would they hold more or less water?
is that water percentage by weight or volume? and what is the error on it? ie Plus / Minus how much?
Aaron
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Oh my lord! I can only imagine how bad that green coffee tea might be.
Actually, I'm not looking for a sample with a "set" moisture content, just a sample with a "known" moisture content so I can calibrate this darn meter. Not even remotely interested in trying to maintain a set moisture content with the beans I inventory...that would be absurd, and a total waste of time & energy...neither of which I have an abundance.
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Upshot... a question from the peanut gallery, if you'll indulge me...
What do you hope to gain from knowing the moisture content of your green coffee?
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I just purchased a grain moisture tester on eBay to try out on coffee. I think that the calibration is the critical factor on whether this works on corn, or soy beans, or whatever you have...but you have to calibrate using a known sample of the target grain/bean/seed. I bought this for the ridiculous price of $14.00 plus shipping. It is not new, and sold for around $200.00 new. I put some greens I had laying around, and I got a reading of 12%. This could be right, or it could be wrong. I wouldn't know because I don't have a control sample. Anybody know where I can buy greens of a known moisture content? Would love to see my $14.00 investment pay off ;D!
upshot,
Take the greens to your local grain elevator that buys grain from farmers. All grain must be the proper moisture before storing in the elevator so to not spoil. My guess is they would test the greens as a favor and no cost. I grew up in the ag business.
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jspain, I may be wrong but the testing machines I believe are highly calibrated to the specific grain, ie what may work well on wheat would be way off on coffee, as it would on corn as an example too.
out of curiosity I wonder if you say took 100 grams of beans and heated them to say 170 for a few hours to drive the water out of them, then weighed them if that would be semi accurate as to moisture content? You wouldn't want to cook / roast them as other chemical reactions in that process would I am sure burn off other stuff besides water. You may even get away with 10 grams if you had a sensitive enough scale, like a reloading scale maybe.
Aaron
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Upshot... a question from the peanut gallery, if you'll indulge me...
What do you hope to gain from knowing the moisture content of your green coffee?
Hi Peter,
What I "hope" to get, and what I expect to get are two different things. What I expect to get is quantitative information regarding a variable that contributes to the final result of what is in the beverage. As with any agricultural food commodity, proper management of moisture content along the supply chain is critical to ensure quality, and having quantifiable information regarding it is never a bad thing. Even if all one ever sees is that every potential purchase made is from a selection of beans whose moisture content falls within the acceptable range. This is called accountability, and also peace of mind.
What I "hope" to get is a correlation between bean mass density, moisture content, and roast profile that results in the fewest possible surprises. I do not know if that will happen or not, but willing to explore.
I like that you, earlier in this thread, proposed measuring the volume of a sample of beans and establishing a correlation between weight / volume and moisture content. My method is a derivative of this, but one in which moisture content is known, so that a correlation coefficient will be established for any bean type. Again, this is my hope. I am not naive to think this is a given, but again...willing to go down this road because this is how one perfects one's craft. I am not a follower, so I have to endure repeating things that perhaps others take for granted based on trusting what they are told. I am also not a whiner. If things go badly, I own up, and because the former characteristic, I can blame no one but myself.
upshot,
Take the greens to your local grain elevator that buys grain from farmers. All grain must be the proper moisture before storing in the elevator so to not spoil. My guess is they would test the greens as a favor and no cost. I grew up in the ag business.
That's an excellent idea. I don't live very close to any grain elevators, but a short day trip would put me in the heart of California's central valley where grain elevators are as common as gas stations! Thanks again for the suggestion!
Thanks again to you too Peter
Kindly,
Upshot
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Problem solved! Just visited a local roaster who gave me a 300g sample that he tested on the spot using one of the testers that looked quite similar to the one in the link at the beginning of this thread. The sample tested at 11%. I brought it home and put it in my tester and got 15.6%. Using the adjusting feature of the tester, I reset the reading to 11.00, and should be all set to go!
As to the discussion of tracking moisture content, I can now feel confident of where these numbers are when developing roast profiles! Keeping my fingers crossed that doing so will provide some useful information for reproducing a roast!