Santoker R500 / Revolution Roaster

[Fahad]

While I'm sure this sounds familiar to many here, it all started a few years ago with the need to be awake for longer than normally possible..  and now I'm the soon to be proud owner of a Santoker "Revolution" or R500, specifically the "R500X" variant as it is called by the representatives at Santoker.

For those who haven't heard about it, it's a relatively new Chinese 1# gas roaster which has apparently had relatively limited exposure so far, with just more than 100 units produced so far (according to one of their reps) and a significant group of which was exported to the US via a group buy on HB (also where I probably first heard about GCBC).

I started roasting with a HG, graduated to a Corretto / BMHG made with locally sourced components (aside from the thermocouple and datalogging parts) and just made the plunge and committed to this thing. To be honest, I was contemplating going for either a Gene or an HT but ultimately decided to skip those options and go for this beast as I knew I would end up wanting one eventually.

My unit should be reaching me somewhere around the beginning / middle of next month and I'm glad I have enough (is that even possible?!!) spare greens to play around with when I first get it at least, but I'll definitely be on the lookout for some of the exceptional stuff I see moving around here sooner or later.

For those still curious, this is the Chinese posting on TaoBao for the R500D: http://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=20446848908

Anybody here already has one? Search function doesn't seem to show any mention but I reckoned it'd be nice if I could find fellow Santoker owners here to share notes with / bribe for profiles etc. 

[hankua]

Congratulations!
Look forwards hearing your feedback on the roaster. From what I've heard So far it's a very capable machine.

[kboom1]

I was thinking of ordering a Santoker and was on the waiting list to order one over at H-B but decided to spend the extra dough and get a USRC instead mainly for the US support and better build quality. I've followed all the post on coffee salon and watched the development of the 3 bean Santoker . They were having some issues with thermocouples and realtime logging, hope they had it worked out before you ordered. Still a young company and I hope their build quality improves over time.

[Fahad]

Congratulations!
Look forwards hearing your feedback on the roaster. From what I've heard So far it's a very capable machine.

Thanks! I'm really excited, and have a feeling that I won't be outgrowing this machine anytime soon, if ever.

I was thinking of ordering a Santoker and was on the waiting list to order one over at H-B but decided to spend the extra dough and get a USRC instead mainly for the US support and better build quality. I've followed all the post on coffee salon and watched the development of the 3 bean Santoker . They were having some issues with thermocouples and realtime logging, hope they had it worked out before you ordered. Still a young company and I hope their build quality improves over time.

If I was a US resident, I might have considered the USRC. In terms of build quality, it seems (at least from what I've seen) that the Santoker is far from what one might expect given the description, but time will tell.

As for thermocouple interfacing issues and such, I understand it was basically a missing link between Santoker updating the machine design and Dustin not being aware of such change. I am communicating directly with the Santoker guys and they seem responsive enough for general needs.

The roaster should come with all the to-date available "upgrades" (MET probe, sweeping arms in cooling tray, large and small triers, etc.) and I'm pretty hopeful things should work out well.

Now to decide on where this roaster will be placed and how to best accommodate.. Right now I'm thinking something along the lines of on a long-ish bench next to a window facing outside, possibly accompanied by my grinder and espresso machine. Appreciate if anyone has any thoughts on how to place the roaster or tips on setup, I'd also probably want to keep the gas cylinder next to the window on the outside.. or at least I imagine it should work that way.

[John F]

If it's propane the tank needs to be outside.

[mrgreenbean]

It looks like this is about a 2500 dollar unit, does that include shipping?

[Fahad]

If it's propane the tank needs to be outside.

Thanks for confirming that, yes it is indeed propane.

It looks like this is about a 2500 dollar unit, does that include shipping?

As far as I understand, the slightly more basic "R500D" model (not sure what is included and what isn't) is approximately $2.5K USD, while the "upgraded" R500X model is closer to $2.9K USD.

Both prices are FCA China so you'd typically need to have a freight forwarder take care of it in China, arrange freight and a local agent (or yourself) clearing it locally. In my case, shipping to Qatar via air freight (since sea and air surprisingly came out close in cost) looks like it will set me back around an additional $0.5K all inclusive, YMMV.

Update: Adding to the above, the crate is said to be 75 KG (165 lbs) and measures 76x43x80cm (30x17x32" approx.). 

[John F]

I think you will be the first here with one..

Keep us updated from Qatar!

[sonnyhad]

I have a friend who will be in Qatar in the next few days on business, he was there with his Russian wife back in December, her name is Alla, and when he introduced her, it raised a bit of anxiety amongst the locals in the bazaar they were at!

[hankua]

I've been following the Santoker developments and it does appear they copied the Fuji Royal roaster design. As you probably already know it has two burners as the Mini500/800n had four. Air valve looks precise, not sure if its butterfly or aperture design.

I have the 800n 500g roaster with cast iron drum in service for two years and very pleased with the ease of use after initial learning curve. Its probably a good idea to standardize charge weight in the beginning and possible thereafter. My normal charge weight is 1lb which makes the math pretty simple. Normal initial charge temp. is 180c with the turn or bottom at @94c. The Santoker looks to have more heat capacity than the 800n, my gas pressure gauge maxes out @ 300 mmaq with 200mmaq being the normal high setting. So gas and air settings would not transfer between the two roasters, but as I'm hand charting every roast the settings are repeatable (gas & air).

During the first roast of a session, the roaster is not fully heated; after that they are repeatable and consistant with heat and air settings. From the second roast on I lower the heat after charging the drum; low or gas off. Air is on low until 150c, opened up full 30sec-60sec, then back low until just before 1C. My 1C temp. is @194c and I've read the Santoker thermocouple reads lower than mine so the roasting milestones would be at different temps.

My everyday profile would be 5-6 min. Drying, 3-4 min. Ramp., and 2min. Finish. On a light roast 1c starts @ 194c and the roast finishes @ 200c. That's a 6*C ramp in 2 min. My 2C temp is @218c and I try finishing in the middle @208c on my roaster as well.

Your going to have a blast with the Santoker!

[Fahad]

I have a friend who will be in Qatar in the next few days on business, he was there with his Russian wife back in December, her name is Alla, and when he introduced her, it raised a bit of anxiety amongst the locals in the bazaar they were at!

I can imagine the confusion people would get when hearing such a name. That possibility never came to mind before though.

Having been in Houston the past couple of months I'm starting to miss Qatar myself..

@hankua, the learning curve will definitely be there as I'm graduating from a more or less single-variable (heat gun temp) system where I used to keep charge size to 500g as well.

I'm really looking forward to the additional levels of control and faster response time I should be getting. The lack of those in the corretto was frustrating at times, especially when things nosedived into a stall or uncontrollably ramped beyond 1C. A controlled 6 degree ramp over 2 minutes is something I can barely imagine.

Thanks for sharing those parameters, they should still be handy as a general reference even if control points don't transfer.

My guess is that I'm probably also going to want to hand chart the input variables as even though output should be directly linked with Artisan (something else I want to learn ASAP, I used to use RoastLogger), the inputs are not captured anywhere. Somewhere down the road I might find a way to automate capture of inputs somehow.

Might be worth mentioning that for an automatic control version of the Santoker I was quoted approximately double (!) the going price of this model and it was supposedly going to be ready in a few months. Reason stated for such difference in price was that automatic gas control systems were expensive. I generally have my doubts but who am I to argue.

I just received Kenneth Davids' Home Roasting book today, and much more reading material to go with it. Long way ahead of me but I see loads of fun in the horizon!

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk

[hankua]

I have paper logs in PDF/word format; *C and *F. It's helpful to know when the air or heat settings were changed. Generally I log a 10*C intervals from end of drying to 1C and make air/ heat adjustments at that time.