Post by: BoldJava on November 04, 2009, 06:52:44 AM
Gives that precision in pours but my wrist doesn't support a 1/2 gallon pour for too long. Glad one of HeadChange's Hario kettles is headed my way as I suuuurge ahead of Peter on the toy count:
B|Java
Post by: mp on November 04, 2009, 08:50:35 AM
???
Post by: headchange4u on November 04, 2009, 11:45:51 AM
Post by: BoldJava on November 04, 2009, 12:38:33 PM
Is a precise pour worth $176?
???
Not to me, but to some folks. For me? Well, a fine controlled stream is worth $33 plus, just what HeadChange is generously delivering to us.
B|Java
Post by: peter on November 04, 2009, 12:58:55 PM
Gives that precision in pours but my wrist doesn't support a 1/2 gallon pour for too long. Glad one of HeadChange's Hario kettles is headed my way as I suuuurge ahead of Peter on the toy count.
Hey, if Gretchen can manage, your limp-wrist should be able too.
I'd be surprised if some of our metal fabricators didn't jump all over something like this. ModelMaker... are you out there? Come in, ModelMaker...
Post by: mp on November 04, 2009, 05:34:32 PM
Is a precise pour worth $176?
???
Not to me, but to some folks. For me? Well, a fine controlled stream is worth $33 plus, just what HeadChange is generously delivering to us.
B|Java
When you're right ... you're right.
:)
Post by: BoldJava on December 05, 2012, 03:39:32 PM
Post by: John F on December 05, 2012, 04:20:11 PM
Post by: BoldJava on December 05, 2012, 04:32:50 PM
Takahiro rules.. 8)
We are entering a period of GCBC "club-rush" where everyone reevaluates their kettle and upgrades. We have seen this before: vacpots, levers, shaving schtuff. Kettles are in. "Club-rushes" typically have a life of 5.5 months. Get aboard, be the first on your block to upgrade.
Post by: peter on December 05, 2012, 04:34:16 PM
Takahiro rules.. 8)
We are entering a period of GCBC "club-rush" where everyone reevaluates their kettle and upgrades. We have seen this before: vacpots, levers, shaving schtuff. Kettles are in. "Club-rushes" typically have a life of 5.5 months. Get aboard, be the first on your block to upgrade.
I'll resist the flow, and wait for y'all's garage sales. :)
Post by: SJM on December 05, 2012, 04:43:49 PM
We are entering a period of GCBC "club-rush" where everyone reevaluates their kettle and upgrades. We have seen this before: vacpots, levers, shaving schtuff. Kettles are in. "Club-rushes" typically have a life of 5.5 months. Get aboard, be the first on your block to upgrade.
So is an upgrade a change to whichever one you don't already have????
Or is there are trackable stops along the upward route: ....... to Buono to ....... to ......... to ...........????
Post by: BoldJava on December 05, 2012, 04:56:07 PM
...
So is an upgrade a change to whichever one you don't already have? ???
Or is there are trackable stops along the upward route: ....... to Buono to ....... to ......... to ........... ??? ?
You must walk your own kettle-walk. No one can prescribe it for you; no one can walk it for you <wink>. Our Denver friend jumped from his kitchen hot water faucet to a Tikijiro, the Bentley of kettles. Yours may differ.
Post by: milowebailey on December 05, 2012, 05:59:41 PM
Post by: peter on December 05, 2012, 07:03:41 PM
I still like my Bonavita, no need to upgrade.... and I still have my swell kettle B|Pawnin' sold to me for $5 at Yemen fest
Took the words right out of my mouth.
Post by: John F on December 05, 2012, 09:15:10 PM
There are pour spouts on the sides of my kitchen pots and I'm sure I can make good coffee with them (no kettle).
But I wanted to have the the ability to pour one drop and place it exactly where I want it to go. So I can do fancy tricks and stuff. ;) I'm not sure if there are even more than half a dozen or so kettles that will do it.
Like B l incepted said these are individual paths and once we dive into the research a choice comes out. I researched all the options and went with something I don't think can be upgraded. I'm ready to go down this part of the path at this time
Post by: mp on December 05, 2012, 09:27:17 PM
None of this is necessary..
There are pour spouts on the sides of my kitchen pots and I'm sure I can make good coffee with them (no kettle).
But I wanted to have the the ability to pour one drop and place it exactly where I want it to go. So I can do fancy tricks and stuff. ;) I'm not sure if there are even more than half a dozen or so kettles that will do it.
Like B l incepted said these are individual paths and once we dive into the research a choice comes out. I researched all the options and went with something I don't think can be upgraded. I'm ready to go down this part of the path at this time
Enjoy the journey!
:)
Post by: ecc on December 05, 2012, 09:38:37 PM
Post by: staylor on December 05, 2012, 11:23:52 PM
None of this is necessary...
... these are individual paths and once we dive into the research a choice comes out.
Bravo.
Post by: Richdel on December 06, 2012, 03:43:40 AM
Post by: BoldJava on December 06, 2012, 05:42:49 AM
I am ready to bid on the the forgotten and left-behind vessels as you go deeper down your journey of discovery. Think of me as King Ferdinand financing your expedition to parts yet unknown.
I anticipate tons of tin litter along the road as members cast aside yesterday's water-haulers.
(http://cdn.lightgalleries.net/4bd5ec12b739d/images/Teakettle-Junction-Death-Valley-NP-100286_34w-2.jpg)
Post by: MMW on December 06, 2012, 08:16:39 AM
Post by: MMW on December 06, 2012, 08:30:04 AM
They should have made it with foot controls...
and plumbed into the water supply.
Filling the kettle is the most annoying part of the whole process.
Susan
I need one of those bunn commercial brewers, a couple of sewing machine foot pedals, and an arduino. STAT. 8)
Post by: John F on December 06, 2012, 08:54:27 AM
Takahiro wins with flow rates of one drop per min and up.
Post by: milowebailey on December 06, 2012, 09:09:54 AM
"flow rates between 4 and 15oz per min"True, but with a little modification I'm sure you could change the flow rate.... or build your own!!
Takahiro wins with flow rates of one drop per min and up.
Post by: John F on December 06, 2012, 11:09:25 AM
It's magnificent!
The reality is that I don't have any way to compare it to other thin spout pouring kettles but I can compare it to standard electric kettles like the Melita, Aroma, and the standard kettles available in stores.
No comparison whatsoever.
I think now that any kettle that gives you very fine control is worth seeking out should you be pourover inclined. I've got loads and loads of pours to make before I have a handle on exactly what I want to do with it but water control at this level produces immediately noticeable differences in depth of the cup and extraction smoothness.
Without ever holding another thin spout kettle in my hand I can't say how one stacks up against the other I can only say the Takahiro offers plenty of size, an attractive look, very nice balance / feel, and for me unprecedented control. It's very sturdy and I totally dig it.
Post by: SJM on December 06, 2012, 11:12:54 AM
Are you heating the water in the Takahiro on the stove or transferring it from your Aroma into the Takahiro and then doing the pourover? Do you have to do a brief re-heat (I do with the Buono)?
(My interest in the Bonavita kettle is to possibly eliminate the transfer/reheat step and still have adequate control.)
Post by: John F on December 06, 2012, 11:28:04 AM
Cool!!!!
Are you heating the water in the Takahiro on the stove or transferring it from your Aroma into the Takahiro and then doing the pourover? Do you have to do a brief re-heat (I do with the Buono)?
(My interest in the Bonavita kettle is to possibly eliminate the transfer/reheat step and still have adequate control.)
Good question and timely because I just did temp testing on this very thing.
If I do a straight transfer from the Aoma to the Takahiro the water temp in kettle is 193-194.
Temp in the Aroma off boil is ~200.
If I preheat a burner and set the Tak on the burner after transfer it gets to boil in under 10 seconds.
These are the water temp basics and I'm unclear on what the ~7 degree temp drop means to me at this point but I'm unlikely to heat water in the Tak. I prefer to transfer but if I decide it matters I'll hit it with 10 seconds of supplemental heat after transfer if needed.
Taste is going to have to be the guide as I find little info on slurry temps and this is where things start shifting faster than in kettle water temps.
Post by: SJM on December 06, 2012, 11:33:25 AM
I'm unlikely to heat water in the Tak. I
I tried that once with the Buono and it took so long I almost lost interest in having coffee.....:-((((((
Susan
Post by: MMW on December 06, 2012, 11:40:20 AM
... I'm unlikely to heat water in the Tak. ...
Why?
Post by: BoldJava on December 06, 2012, 11:40:32 AM
After some initial testing here are my first thoughts of the Takahiro..
It's magnificent!
...
And the white jammies, how do they fit?
Post by: John F on December 06, 2012, 11:42:01 AM
Why?
Time like Susan said.
Electric kettles are like lightening fast compared to stovetop kettle heating.
Post by: John F on December 06, 2012, 11:47:23 AM
And the white jammies, how do they fit?
Post by: MMW on December 06, 2012, 11:51:05 AM
Why?
Time like Susan said.
Electric kettles are like lightening fast compared to stovetop kettle heating.
Gotcha. Thanks.
And the white jammies, how do they fit?
([url]http://www.greencoffeebuyingclub.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=7739.0;attach=13563;image[/url])
If you wear them, how do know if you're awake or asleep? :o
(Sorry for all the dumb questions.)
Post by: John F on December 06, 2012, 11:57:47 AM
If you wear them, how do know if you're awake or asleep? :o
Two old sayings explain it best.
In a con if you can't spot the mark it's you.
At a poker table if you can't spot the fish it's you.
Post by: BoldJava on December 06, 2012, 02:07:39 PM
Thought I would put a list of gooseneck kettles together so folks could add one to their list of "wished for gifts" and hand it to their spouses/partners. I would buy any of them except the Hario. The Hario is the least precise pour of those I have tested. (There will be a post-Christmas sale of all the leftover cettles starting on Jan 2nd).
Members can offer their own impressions/reviews of those they have used. Kettles to konsider:
1. Takahiro - John's ticket: $120.
2. Hario - most common one out there: $53: 
3. Bonavita - has put a dent in Hario sales: $30/plain kettle for stove. 
4. Bonavita electric kettle: $50 
5. Bonavita variable/constant temp kettle: $90 6. Tiamo kettles, entire spectrum of stove kettles, .42L to 1.6L kettles: 7. Kalita Wave kettle: $107. 
8. My Paico kettle: $33 shipped from Hong Kong.
Post by: John F on December 06, 2012, 02:13:12 PM
My sense is that the Tiamo is very good and the Kalita a bit better but the ones I'm curious about are the $30 Bonivita and the one with the wooden handle because they stand to deliver results above their modest price points.
No idea where to get it but casual products makes the wood handle one.
Post by: SJM on December 06, 2012, 02:16:52 PM
I would buy any of them except the Hario. The Hario is the least precise pour of those I have tested.
Damn....
Guess the Bonavita Electric is gonna be my next chettle....
Wabbit
Post by: BoldJava on December 07, 2012, 07:42:00 PM
This is the closest I've found to the single drop kettle brew technique.
That is the kettle that I grabbed 6 of and sold to the guys at $5/each.
Post by: peter on December 07, 2012, 07:55:38 PM
This is the closest I've found to the single drop kettle brew technique.
That is the kettle that I grabbed 6 of and sold to the guys at $5/each.
And it works even better than that rookie in the video.
Post by: bekeld on December 08, 2012, 04:56:32 AM
They should have made it with foot controls...Nay. Remote control.
Post by: John F on December 08, 2012, 06:01:25 AM
I do like the spout shape and rustic wood handle look.
Post by: SJM on December 08, 2012, 08:20:52 AM
Is there a face-off somewhere that I missed between the Takahiro and the Bonavita Electric? I'm looking for the best pour that doesn't require a transfer from the heating kettle to the pouring kettle. And I'm not actually unhappy with the Aroma-Buono combination, but....a better pour is a better pour....
Which leads me in a roundabout fashion to my last point: is a drop-at-a-time really desirable? How the bleep could it possibly finish in a reasonable amount of time????
Okay, it's true, I haven't had coffee yet....so feel free to ignore me.
Susan
Post by: BoldJava on December 08, 2012, 09:02:22 AM
... I get it that the Buono is now the bottom of the heap, but I can't see how this kettle could be better given how far your hand would be from the point at which you would be trying to control the pour.
Is there a face-off somewhere that I missed between the Takahiro and the Bonavita Electric? ...
Which leads me in a roundabout fashion to my last point: is a drop-at-a-time really desirable?
We each will have a different take on this and I will offer mine.
You are going to get an excellent pour and control effort from your Hario Buono. Hario was the first out of the gate with a home-kettle that spoke to the needs of a homebrewer. Their tip is more blunt that the rest of the pack. Despite that, I doubt that I could discern in a blind cupping that Hario vs the Takahiro.
When it comes to kettles, 3 (possibly 4) things are important:
1) Volume. I want nothing less than a liter -- that is the size I need to brew the KONE/Chemex set-up.
2) Ability to heat on the stove.
3) Tip. Dropping the water in a flow desired, where desired, is the ultimate control. No, you don't need to put a single drop down anywhere. Knowing you can, though, is fun and gives John bragging rights at this point because I believe he can do that with the Takahiro.
4) Aesthetics.
I know of no one on any of the coffee boards who has put the Takahiro to the test against the Bonavita.
Post by: SJM on December 08, 2012, 09:06:43 AM
I think that answers all my questions.
The only one left is whether I need/want a Bonavita Electric so as to eliminate the transfer and heat loss in going from the Aroma to the Buono.
The Bonavita is in my "cart" at Amazon along with a Hario Range Server....
Question is whether or not these will be my Xmas to myself....:-))))
Susan
who is really good at sitting on fences
Post by: John F on December 08, 2012, 09:07:17 AM
But you can.
More control is better.
For the record I've brewed zero one drop at a time cups. But I have dropped single drops in pinpoint spots. I also giggled when I did it. ;D
Post by: BoldJava on December 08, 2012, 09:13:49 AM
...
The only one left is whether I need/want a Bonavita Electric so as to eliminate the transfer and heat loss in going from the Aroma to the Buono.
The Bonavita is in my "cart" at Amazon along with a Hario Range Server....
Question is whether or not these will be my Xmas to myself....:-))))
Let me help you get off the fence....buy it... if speed is your issue. If not, just fill that Buono to the tip top and use the 15 minutes for a morning reflection.
Post by: John F on December 08, 2012, 09:20:05 AM
I'd also forfeit my chance to win it if that matters but I can't make myself drop $40 on it because I know I don't need 2 kettles.
Post by: SJM on December 08, 2012, 09:20:53 AM
I also giggled when I did it. ;D
We need pictures.....
of the giggling.....:-))))
Post by: SJM on December 08, 2012, 09:25:39 AM
If somebody did a roadshow on the Bonavita I'd be down for doing a side by side with vid comparison.
I'd also forfeit my chance to win it if that matters but I can't make myself drop $40 on it because I know I don't need 2 kettles.
What exactly does it take to set up the roadshow?
I don't think I can do the vid part, but I'd be willing to get the rest of the set up set up if someone will give me some pointers....
Susan
Post by: mp on December 08, 2012, 12:04:31 PM
If somebody did a roadshow on the Bonavita I'd be down for doing a side by side with vid comparison.
I'd also forfeit my chance to win it if that matters but I can't make myself drop $40 on it because I know I don't need 2 kettles.
What exactly does it take to set up the roadshow?
I don't think I can do the vid part, but I'd be willing to get the rest of the set up set up if someone will give me some pointers....
Susan
B|RoadShow can correct me but I believe it is just a matter of sourcing the item, setting up a new thread advertising the road show, having 10 or so people sign up and pay their proportionate cost of the kettle, then you keep it a week or so, evaluate it, post your evaluation, move the kettle to the next one on the list, and sometime during all this you put the participants names into a hat and blindly draw the winner.
You may switch the steps up so that it makes better logistical sense.
I think this is it in a nutshell.
:)
Post by: SJM on December 08, 2012, 01:44:54 PM
B|RoadShow can correct me but I believe it is just a matter of sourcing the item, setting up a new thread advertising the road show, having 10 or so people sign up and pay their proportionate cost of the kettle, then you keep it a week or so, evaluate it, post your evaluation, move the kettle to the next one on the list, and sometime during all this you put the participants names into a hat and blindly draw the winner.
You may switch the steps up so that it makes better logistical sense.
I think this is it in a nutshell.
:)
[/quote]
That sounds right.
I can do that....
New thread coming up.
Thanks MP.
Post by: John F on December 08, 2012, 01:48:21 PM
I'm glad to do the comparison to help us understand the differences and help members make a choice.
Post by: Richdel on December 09, 2012, 07:42:16 AM
Very little control, holds almost 50 ounces, and I paid $4 at a local resale shop.
The pictured one is not mine, but it is identical to mine. May be time to step up
my pourover game and move to something that offers a bit more control.
Post by: Richdel on December 09, 2012, 09:32:51 AM
at the Oneida, and if a restrictor is going to be placed in the spout,
it will need to be placed from the tip of the spout .
Inside the vessel, where the neck opening is, there is a built-in restrictor,
that has 24 holes ( smaller then a shoelace eyelet). Not sure how to restrict
water flow except covering up some of the holes. Can't come up with any
idea on how to do that that doesn't seem really jury-rigged or very time consuming.
Sooo, it is Christmas time, and I went ahead and purchased myself a small present.
Straight from Homeloo website and the shores of Hong Kong, hopefully it will be here before Christmas.
(http://www.homeloo.com/shop/oscthumb.php?src=lMzVwtXM2I6il5Sgj9jXzA..&w=398&h=399&fltr[]=wmt|homeloo.com|18|C|000000|arial.ttf|10|30|0&f=jpg&q=1000&hash=1de540e75af72a6c6348c29934296768)
Post by: peter on December 09, 2012, 10:40:26 AM
Not sure how to restrict
water flow except covering up some of the holes. Can't come up with any
idea on how to do that that doesn't seem really jury-rigged or very time consuming.
Toothpicks?
Post by: Richdel on December 09, 2012, 03:43:49 PM
Not sure how to restrict
water flow except covering up some of the holes. Can't come up with any
idea on how to do that that doesn't seem really jury-rigged or very time consuming.
Toothpicks?
Yes I guess enough toothpicks might work, but I am sure that over the course of several uses they might work themselves loose. Plus the opening at the top is such a small diameter, that it would be a bit difficult to get my hand down there to push the toothpicks into the holes with any type of force.
But I think it would work, so thank you.
Post by: Richdel on December 24, 2012, 02:39:41 PM
No way to attach handle! Merry Christmas. Looks like I will be using 'Ove Glove to pour as I hold the stainless steel body filled with 200* water.
Post by: John F on December 24, 2012, 02:44:25 PM
Post by: Richdel on December 24, 2012, 03:58:59 PM
JB Weld.
I guess that is an option, but a last option. Hoping to hear back from Mr Angus Chan as to how he advises I move forward on this issue. Not like I can go down to the local shop owner and exchange it. Good thing this wasn't a Christmas present for anyone important. Just me... ;D
Post by: Richdel on December 26, 2012, 07:22:03 AM
Post by: simmich on December 26, 2012, 08:35:03 AM
Post by: John F on December 26, 2012, 10:32:14 AM
I can't view that strange link above.
Post by: Richdel on December 26, 2012, 11:09:24 AM
You can see the bracket that the handle attaches to, mine came without that bracket.
Post by: John F on December 26, 2012, 11:24:43 AM
Big pita to send it back and get a replacement but for the price maybe....
Post by: Richdel on December 27, 2012, 02:03:35 PM
Beginning to think I may have to write this one off as
lost dollars. Really makes you think how important it is
to buy local/support local. Even if it is a few $$$ more.
Post by: peter on December 27, 2012, 02:11:21 PM
Another day passes,and still no reply from Mr. Chan.
Beginning to think I may have to write this one off as
lost dollars. Really makes you think how important it is
to buy local/support local. Even if it is a few $$$ more.
If they end up refunding your money, and/or sending a replacement and tell you to keep that one, I'd take it off your hands. Let me know what happens, and perhaps we can work something out.
Post by: BoldJava on December 27, 2012, 05:47:47 PM
Sitting in the cart at Orphan's. Waiting to pull that trigger on a 1.2 liter kettle.
Post by: John F on December 27, 2012, 05:53:50 PM
Post by: BoldJava on December 27, 2012, 05:55:28 PM
Buono, Takahiro, and Kalita, l-r.
Post by: John F on December 27, 2012, 05:57:44 PM
Post by: BoldJava on December 27, 2012, 06:00:46 PM
Coffee Hand-Drip Kettle Lineup (http://www.flickr.com/photos/nickcho/5530288428/#)
Post by: John F on December 27, 2012, 06:06:09 PM
Of course I've never poured with the Yukiwa but it looks way clunky compared to the spouts that remain thin all the way.
Post by: John F on December 27, 2012, 06:13:28 PM
Post by: John F on December 27, 2012, 06:42:00 PM
The copper/brass one has a tip like the Tiamo or Tak....
Post by: BoldJava on December 27, 2012, 06:53:17 PM
I don't like that style tip either.
The copper/brass one has a tip like the Tiamo or Tak....
Nick swears by it for control.
Post by: John F on December 27, 2012, 07:09:14 PM
The thing is that we are talking about slight edges when comparing one high end kettle against another. These edges are further exploited by individual techniques so that one handle shape is better for me but something else better for you. Spout, tip, etc, etc..
I'd have to pour with it to see but this much I'm confident about... A thin spout starting from the base of a kettle beats the daylights out of a beak style spout at the top of the kettle. Aside from just the spout being small balance is vital.
Post by: peter on December 27, 2012, 07:23:41 PM
Post by: John F on December 27, 2012, 07:29:18 PM
Post by: peter on December 27, 2012, 07:42:58 PM
Post by: John F on December 27, 2012, 07:51:05 PM
Mine is more hypodermic than squeezed maybe you could use a grinder of some sort to get an even pointer point.
Post by: peter on December 27, 2012, 08:11:15 PM
Post by: bekeld on December 27, 2012, 08:27:23 PM
Post by: peter on December 27, 2012, 08:35:48 PM
Nothing good can come of this... ;)
That's the risk one runs when one is a trendsetter.
;D I just made myself laugh.
Post by: BoldJava on December 28, 2012, 04:31:07 AM
He could be right.
The thing is that we are talking about slight edges when comparing one high end kettle against another....
Not sure where I read it but Nick partially attributes the pour control to the stout base of the neck relative to the tip (just opposite of the Bonavita -- which is the same diameter throughout the neck). He says something about the the neck's design on the Kalita prevents a syphon effect being created. I don't get the physics involved. Wish I had paid more attention in class.
Thought I would mention that so our blacksmith can heat up the furnace, get out the anvil and hammer, and get busy on something beside the tip of the spout. Had a ton of lines for Peter's tip/pliers routine but the silent voice of the Czarina was heard this a.m. It is often a very good, judicious filter which is often employed.
(http://www.wickedjoe.com/java/images/uploads/Kalita_1L_Wave_Kettle.jpg)
Post by: BoldJava on December 28, 2012, 04:37:43 AM
(http://www.artinthepicture.com/artists/Peder-Severin_Kroyer/blacksmith.jpg)
Post by: John F on December 28, 2012, 08:48:42 AM
Not sure where I read it but Nick partially attributes the pour control to the stout base of the neck relative to the tip (just opposite of the Bonavita -- which is the same diameter throughout the neck). He says something about the the neck's design on the Kalita prevents a syphon effect being created. I don't get the physics involved. Wish I had paid more attention in class.
He has a load of kettles and is in better position than most to comment on the differences.
The first thing that came to my mind was just to grab my phone and make a quick vid of why I think syphon issues have less to do with the diameter of the spout/tip and more to do with the spout starting at the base of the kettle and terminating as high as possible at/near the water level when full.
A smart thing to do would have been to drink my first cup of coffee, gather my thoughts, organize some details and then make a quick vid. I of course am more impulsive than smart so you get a straight out of bed, no coffee, disorganized ramble..... If it helps turn the sound off and just watch the vid. ???
Takiaharo syphon question
Post by: bekeld on December 28, 2012, 10:16:11 AM
I would also postulate that the wider diameter of the base in contrast to a narrower tip keeps the pressure of the flow more consistent than a spout that is the same diameter from base to tip. That would create just enough back pressure to help control the flow. I think both elements are needed.
The analogy I thought of is breath control for musicians. If you just breath in and push out, it's like that big spouted pot in the video. Everything pours out fast, goes wherever it goes. When breathing properly, you have a big base (abdomen), narrower diameter at end, and a lot of back pressure to control how much air is released and where the air goes.
I really thought that this thread was tending toward überobsessive, but seeing John's video and knowing how my Hario and Bonavita pour, I am amazed at the difference in the ease of control.
Post by: John F on December 28, 2012, 10:21:18 AM
I really thought that this thread was tending toward überobsessive, but seeing John's video and knowing how my Hario and Bonvita pour, I am amazed at the difference in the ease of control.
And I was one handing it with the phone recording in the other mostly watching the camera.
The control is literally drop by drop if you want it. The action is in super slight wrist movement because as you see the water level is already right there at the tip of the spout...you are only moving very slightly because you are not moving water far at all.
Post by: BoldJava on December 28, 2012, 10:22:18 AM
...I really thought that this thread was tending toward überobsessive, but seeing John's video and knowing how my Hario and Bonvita pour, I am amazed at the difference in the ease of control.
Nuts, I hoped we had ventured into über-land.
(http://www.wearemullen.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/1-logo.jpg)
Post by: peter on December 28, 2012, 10:23:36 AM
The wider base of the spout might make some difference, and it does in my mind, but I really don't think it should affect flow rate. The two key issues to me are tip design, and spout shape. The "S" of the Bonavita is too tight; it should be more stretched out and horizontal.
Having the tip of the Bonavita spout squished does help. I can get a smaller stream to flow more smoothly. Before, if the flow was too slow, it would dribble, and to get the dribble to stop it had to flow faster than I'd like. Now it'll flow slower w/o dribbling.
Post by: bekeld on December 28, 2012, 10:28:43 AM
Post by: peter on December 28, 2012, 10:32:25 AM
While you guys were posting I made a major modification to my post explaining why a big base/narrow tip is needed for an ultra controlled pour. I'd be interested to see if it makes sense. :)
I understand the principal you're describing and think it makes sense, but only if the spout is offering some resistance to the volume coming into the base. At the flow rates we're pouring at, the water is coming out slowly enough that IMHO having the wider base won't matter.
Post by: bekeld on December 28, 2012, 10:33:49 AM
Before, if the flow was too slow, it would dribble, and to get the dribble to stop it had to flow faster than I'd like. Now it'll flow slower w/o dribbling.Yup. The dribbling with both of my pots is why I started reading this thread. I hate dribbling on my desk at school--I use the electric Bonavita there. I was going to change up and use a hot plate and the Hario, but that dribbles just as much. Looks like some blacksmithing is needed. :)
Post by: John F on December 28, 2012, 10:36:54 AM
Having the tip of the Bonavita spout squished does help. I can get a smaller stream to flow more smoothly. Before, if the flow was too slow, it would dribble, and to get the dribble to stop it had to flow faster than I'd like. Now it'll flow slower w/o dribbling.
It confuses me more than explains anything.
I might do another vid if I can think about this for a second..
Post by: bekeld on December 28, 2012, 10:42:28 AM
I understand the principal you're describing and think it makes sense, but only if the spout is offering some resistance to the volume coming into the base. At the flow rates we're pouring at, the water is coming out slowly enough that IMHO having the wider base won't matter.The narrowing of the neck diameter creates the resistance. The neat thing about friction & resistance is that it doesn't take a big change to have a big result. The only difference in breath control for a vocalist is the narrowing of the throat. For an instrumentalist, the throat, mouth, and the embouchure (mouth opening) are narrower. Even for a big bore horn like a tuba, the elements are the same as for a flute.
Post by: RobertL on December 28, 2012, 11:31:33 AM
The "S" of the Bonavita is too tight; it should be more stretched out and horizontal.
I agree, this is the first thing I noticed when comparing the roadshow Bonavita to my Paico kettle. See the link below with picture for comparison.
http://www.greencoffeebuyingclub.com/index.php?topic=12695.msg208453#msg208453 (http://www.greencoffeebuyingclub.com/index.php?topic=12695.msg208453#msg208453)
Post by: peter on December 28, 2012, 01:43:12 PM
I understand the principal you're describing and think it makes sense, but only if the spout is offering some resistance to the volume coming into the base. At the flow rates we're pouring at, the water is coming out slowly enough that IMHO having the wider base won't matter.The narrowing of the neck diameter creates the resistance. The neat thing about friction & resistance is that it doesn't take a big change to have a big result. The only difference in breath control for a vocalist is the narrowing of the throat. For an instrumentalist, the throat, mouth, and the embouchure (mouth opening) are narrower. Even for a big bore horn like a tuba, the elements are the same as for a flute.
But I still think the above only applies if you're pouring fast enough for the smaller spout to offer some resistance, and don't think we do.
Post by: Tex on December 28, 2012, 01:52:52 PM
A friend ordered one of these for the rectory. Seems like a bit frou-frou for the pour over faithful, but it looks like it'll work well enough.
(http://i.ebayimg.com/t/drip-bar-4-filter-removable-tray-stainless-5003248-/00/$%28KGrHqV,!l0E5Y8V!40%28BO%28QbPsRig~~_3.JPG) (http://www.ebay.com/itm/drip-bar-4-filter-removable-tray-stainless-5003248-/130786124052)
Post by: mp on December 28, 2012, 02:00:37 PM
You going to put it to good use Robert?
:)
Post by: John F on December 28, 2012, 03:25:19 PM
Yes...yes I will.
I don't think the wider base spout tapering down can matter much if at all.
kettle pouring (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcQ0J7C02uk#ws)
Post by: mp on December 28, 2012, 03:32:21 PM
;)
Post by: John F on December 28, 2012, 03:42:43 PM
Now that was an excellent over-analysis!
;)
Over analysis is my middle name.
Post by: mp on December 28, 2012, 03:47:04 PM
Now that was an excellent over-analysis!
;)
Over analysis is my middle name.
Are you going to venture out and take the pliers to your kettle like Peter?
;D
Post by: John F on December 28, 2012, 03:51:33 PM
As stated I'm not sure a higher level of control is either possible or needed than what I have now.
Post by: mp on December 28, 2012, 04:02:40 PM
Not a chance.
As stated I'm not sure a higher level of control is either possible or needed than what I have now.
Yeah, I can see by your pours a very fine level of control.
:)
Post by: John F on December 28, 2012, 04:51:31 PM
Post by: BoldJava on December 28, 2012, 05:09:45 PM
Will I ramble on more?
...
Man, that sounded like John Madden doing color commentary on an NFL game!
John Madden Bootleg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SzfcMX84YGM#)
Post by: mp on December 28, 2012, 05:11:39 PM
Will I ramble on more?
...
Man, that sounded like John Madden doing color commentary on an NFL game!
John Madden Bootleg ([url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SzfcMX84YGM#[/url])
John F. Madden.
;D
Post by: Richdel on December 28, 2012, 05:23:02 PM
In an effort to be fair, I have been paging Mr Angus Chan (of Homeloo)
since Christmas Eve. He has responded. He is going to send me a new
handle. The only problem with that solution, is I was sent a handle.
I need a kettle with a BRACKET so I can attach the handle to the kettle.
Thinking that this lack of communications could go on until Easter,
I have sent a pictue (jpeg), hoping that a picture is truly worth a thousand words.
I have a feeling that the handle will be on my doorstep by the end of next week,
and my most recent email (wth jpeg) will go unanswered. We shall see.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-JG3i3SxZphg/UN48xALbeHI/AAAAAAAAAVI/pv24TtOAvOc/w252-h336-k/2012-12-28_19-42-12_HDR.jpg)
Post by: peter on December 28, 2012, 05:24:29 PM
Post by: peter on December 28, 2012, 08:42:03 PM
So a hose clamp should make it functional, not pretty.
Or a drill, a ss screw w/ a silicone o-ring, a spacer, and a nut.
Post by: Richdel on December 29, 2012, 05:36:31 AM
All sales on hold until I find out how this defective unit will be handled.
Post by: Richdel on December 30, 2012, 04:47:40 AM
Post by: BoldJava on December 30, 2012, 08:25:04 AM
Result: The water was preheated into the Pino to 210* and poured into the Paiku right off the shelf. The result was a 193.7* in the water. Pre-heating is wise.
Note: still haven't pulled the trigger on the Tiamo.
(http://www.greencoffeebuyingclub.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=7007.0;attach=9209;image)
Post by: John F on December 30, 2012, 09:30:57 AM
8)
Post by: BoldJava on December 30, 2012, 10:06:01 AM
You haven't pulled the trigger because you want the Tak...
8)
If it were a 1.2L, it would be in my kitchen.
Post by: John F on December 30, 2012, 08:12:14 PM
If it were a 1.2L, it would be in my kitchen.
How bad do you need that .3 of a litre?
Post by: BoldJava on December 31, 2012, 02:10:02 AM
If it were a 1.2L, it would be in my kitchen.
How bad do you need that .3 of a litre?
Really badly. I make 1 liter into a thermo/carafe with pourovers and the same volume with the KONE/Chemex. I need about 1.1 liters to accomplish that. We kill that amount of coffee every morning -- our standard fare. If anything, our volume needs will increase as the Czarina retires Friday. She isn't bashful about reminding me that she needn't find the time clock nor the alarm clock before I have the same luxury.
Post by: John F on December 31, 2012, 05:46:03 AM
I know you have ways to do that now...do you ever brew less than that in a session?
Trying to do my part ya know... ;
Post by: BoldJava on December 31, 2012, 06:43:58 AM
You only make 1 liter batches.
I know you have ways to do that now...do you ever brew less than that in a session?
Trying to do my part ya know... ;
On occasion, I will brew one cup via a pourover Hario setup or an Espro. My Paiku will hold 40 oz (1.2 l)when filled to the top. She rattles, but works. It has a great tip and I can do the 1-3 drips anywhere though I don't think it would win in a head-to-head with your Takahiro.
My interest in the Tiamo is merely my foster'in.
B|Java
Post by: BoldJava on January 01, 2013, 07:41:41 AM
http://www.ucc-america.com/brewingequipment.php (http://www.ucc-america.com/brewingequipment.php)
Their US rep is Jay Egami -- a former MMA featherweight. Some of his fights are on UTube. I can't make this stuff up -- his forum is
http://www.myfightteam.com/ (http://www.myfightteam.com/)
No wonder John is a Takahiro-hero.
Post by: John F on January 01, 2013, 08:31:49 AM
But I like it. 8)
Post by: BoldJava on January 01, 2013, 08:44:14 AM
... They had the Tiamo kettle with the thermometer in the lid on the shelves, but I resisted...
I now have the 1.2 Tiamo and a thermometer which sits in the lid in the cart at Orphan Espresso. They are on vacation. Hair-trigger finger in "the ready."
Post by: John F on January 01, 2013, 09:12:30 AM
Tak with thermometer in lid.
Post by: BoldJava on January 03, 2013, 05:58:42 PM
http://global.rakuten.com/en/store/fcollection2007/item/983004/ (http://global.rakuten.com/en/store/fcollection2007/item/983004/)
Post by: ecc on January 03, 2013, 06:01:42 PM
Post by: BoldJava on January 03, 2013, 06:03:21 PM
Where do you plug it in?
Peter's house. Has a longer cord than most. I will fill it with the hydrant across the street.
Post by: BoldJava on January 03, 2013, 06:04:10 PM
Hmmm, I wonder if it's cheaper to ship a dozen? ;D
You guys are killin' me. <wink>
Post by: peter on January 03, 2013, 07:18:15 PM
Post by: John F on January 03, 2013, 11:32:23 PM
I ordered it
It was always a matter of time. 8)
Post by: BoldJava on January 04, 2013, 02:40:43 AM
I ordered it
It was always a matter of time. 8)
Stars aligned. While I had finally put the 1.2L Tiamo in the cart, OE's shop is closed for a period of time. Let's see if it arrives -- a cliff hangar on which to end this week's show to help improve ratings.
Post by: Richdel on January 04, 2013, 02:59:32 AM
in the Land of the Setting Sun rather then Pearl of the Orient.
I do have a question, are you buying a new Takahiro or a used
Takahiro? The statement at the bottom implies it could be used:
"...I receive present packing and have it. ..."
So that picture may not be a stock photo, but rather the unit you are
going to be receiving in use.
Post by: BoldJava on January 04, 2013, 03:17:02 AM
...are you buying a new or...used...
So that picture may not be a stock photo, but rather the unit you are
going to be receiving in use.
And ruin next week's show? Tune in next week to find out...
Post by: BoldJava on January 04, 2013, 07:58:05 AM
Bold, you could have had my parents' pouring kettle if you really wanted to go big and bold.
...
Man, I could put a drop any where I wanted with that badd boyy.
B|Java
Post by: John F on January 04, 2013, 08:43:47 AM
Post by: peter on January 04, 2013, 10:27:08 AM
What is clever though, is the stainless steel wire mod (a further refinement of the clever cotter mod) on the Bonavita's spout. It is now the perfect pouring pot.
Post by: BoldJava on January 04, 2013, 10:38:52 AM
...
What is clever though, is the stainless steel wire mod (a further refinement of the clever cotter mod) on the Bonavita's spout. It is now the perfect pouring pot.
(http://www.africaboundadventures.com/sites/default/files/images/Elephant's%20Trunk!(1).jpg)
Post by: John F on January 04, 2013, 10:52:40 AM
Post by: bekeld on January 04, 2013, 01:34:55 PM
I'm going to take the pot home today and hope I don't mangle the spout as I do the Peter squoosh to the tip.
Post by: peter on January 04, 2013, 02:20:41 PM
I was using my Bonavita today at school and dribbled all over my desk. grrrrrr
I'm going to take the pot home today and hope I don't mangle the spout as I do the Peter squoosh to the tip.
Squishing the tip had some benefit, but the wire is where it's at. It's less about restricting the flow, and more about giving the water a thin/pointy jumping off point.
Post by: BoldJava on January 04, 2013, 03:48:57 PM
(https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/s480x480/397628_10152398540535343_724301968_n.jpg)
Post by: John F on January 04, 2013, 04:05:14 PM
Post by: ecc on January 04, 2013, 04:29:37 PM
Post by: peter on January 04, 2013, 04:42:42 PM
I noticed these flow restrictors ([url]http://store.georgehowellcoffee.com/equipment/flow_restrictor.html[/url]) for Hario and Bonavita kettles at Terroir. I have one on my road Hario, installed invisibly inside and it has pretty pour performance. (that's good)
I have something like that in my Bonavita, a.k.a. a small piece of tubing cut to fit at the base of the neck.
But I still say restricting is not as critical as how the water leaves the spout, i.e. shape of the spout's tip.
Post by: az erik on January 04, 2013, 04:48:10 PM
Sent from my iPhone5 using Tapatalk so pardon my spelling.
Post by: peter on January 04, 2013, 05:11:04 PM
You guys crack me up!
Sent from my iPhone5 using Tapatalk so pardon my spelling.
This serious stuff, Jackson!
Post by: John F on January 04, 2013, 05:12:13 PM
You guys crack me up!
We are crazy like that..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2e0-MeIdNc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2e0-MeIdNc#)
Post by: John F on January 04, 2013, 05:16:52 PM
Wow, that's a serious pour.
I was trying to think of something that would translate...
Post by: BoldJava on January 04, 2013, 05:30:53 PM
You guys crack me up!
We are crazy like that..
That's nothing. My Paico can draw the water right out of that bottle cap, drop by drop.
Post by: John F on January 04, 2013, 05:34:57 PM
5 min of drops and blabbering. :P
Post by: ecc on January 04, 2013, 05:51:23 PM
4. Surface Tension in Fluid Mechanics (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUlmkSnrAzM#)
Post by: BoldJava on January 04, 2013, 05:51:56 PM
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Kalita-Style-Barista-Coffee-Drip-Pot-Coffee-Drip-Kettle-1-2L-Stainless-18-8-/110957751902 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Kalita-Style-Barista-Coffee-Drip-Pot-Coffee-Drip-Kettle-1-2L-Stainless-18-8-/110957751902)
.7 liter, $50, http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2047675.m570.l1313&_nkw=kalita+kettle&_sacat=0&_from=R40 (http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2047675.m570.l1313&_nkw=kalita+kettle&_sacat=0&_from=R40)
(http://trubru.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/accessories-kalita_pot.jpg)
Post by: John F on January 04, 2013, 05:52:34 PM
Post by: BoldJava on January 04, 2013, 05:59:22 PM
This might get fun.. 8)
It took 8 pages -- long gestation period.
Post by: John F on January 04, 2013, 06:00:58 PM
I am not sure I like the handle.
Me either... I do like the old copper one that looks like it's 150 years old.
Post by: RobertL on January 04, 2013, 06:02:39 PM
I am not sure I like the handle.
Me either... I do like the old copper one that looks like it's 150 years old.
It can be yours for $216. :)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-KALITA-copper-coffee-pot-table-top-wood-vintage-900ml-one-antique-F-S-/261137573308?pt=Small_Kitchen_Appliances_US&hash=item3ccd0325bc (http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-KALITA-copper-coffee-pot-table-top-wood-vintage-900ml-one-antique-F-S-/261137573308?pt=Small_Kitchen_Appliances_US&hash=item3ccd0325bc)
Post by: John F on January 04, 2013, 06:06:25 PM
But It does have an allure to me for some reason.
Post by: RobertL on January 04, 2013, 06:14:34 PM
http://www.kalita.co.jp/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_48&sort=20a&page=1 (http://www.kalita.co.jp/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_48&sort=20a&page=1)
Post by: SJM on January 04, 2013, 07:11:45 PM
Maybe instead of kettles we should be using syringes for drop by drop coffee production.
Have you ever seen an insulated syringe?
:-)))))
Post by: peter on January 04, 2013, 08:53:41 PM
Bonavita w/ Custom Spout (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDUVOIFzohA#ws)
Post by: RobertL on January 04, 2013, 09:21:30 PM
Post by: BoldJava on January 05, 2013, 02:48:16 AM
I couldn't resist! Not only that, this my first ever video on youtube. I may just have to do a live pour in the morning.
...
Hollywood calls.
Or maybe Bollywood if you practiced a clipped English.
Post by: BoldJava on January 05, 2013, 08:14:11 AM
Nick Cho first mentioned the Kalita thin spouts on a tweet about 1.5 years ago. $60/shipped for a 1.2L. I am not sure I like the handle.
...
Pulled the trigger this morning on the 1.2L Kalita, thin spout. With OE closed, need (want?) the kettle by our pourover throwdown on Jan 25th. Handle? I saw one displayed on eBay or UTube -- it is a flat, 2 layered handle. Not a wire handle as I had supposed. Ships from Seoul. Should have Milo do a group buy.
I already have the demo set up to pour 12 drops on a head of a pin. Dancing angels invited.
B|Java
Post by: BoldJava on January 05, 2013, 10:37:40 AM
Post by: BoldJava on January 08, 2013, 03:57:23 AM
...
Pulled the trigger this morning on the 1.2L Kalita, thin spout...
Got a note. Kettle leaves Seoul this a.m. via airmail. Should be here in time for the Jan 25th pourover in which Peter's Rube Golberg paper clip, aluminum pliers-squished tip challenges it.
Event is being billed as the "Tips that Were Heard 'Round the World." A few choice seats remain, top tier only. SRO goes on sale 8am of day event.
The Prussian Prinz Peter (gold-trim trunks) vs the Far East Bold-Madness (white trunks). "Gentlemen, touch your tips and come out pouring. Bloom on my command."
Post by: John F on January 08, 2013, 05:33:01 AM
Post by: peter on January 08, 2013, 08:47:50 AM
Is that the great Mills Lane judging you two?
There won't be any need for an unbiased judge; the results will be so clear and devastating, that even goatboy will wave the white flag.
And my patent for the clip just went through, a marketing plan is underway, and Kickstarter has agreed to raise the venture capital. This will launch me into early retirement, fo' sho'. ;)
Post by: BoldJava on January 08, 2013, 09:04:05 AM
Is that the great Mills Lane judging you two?
Nein.
Post by: az erik on January 08, 2013, 10:17:50 AM
The Prussian Prinz Peter (gold-trim trunks) vs the Far East Bold-Madness (white trunks). "Gentlemen, touch your tips and come out pouring. Bloom on my command."
LOVE the Ikea light fo the ring, really adds a touch of home :)
Post by: RobertL on January 08, 2013, 07:22:32 PM
Post by: Tex on January 09, 2013, 11:34:22 AM
I think we have this all wrong why do you need to pour one drop at a time? I've got a new contender for the king of pour over kettles....
And look, it even has a shower head, just like the fancy new BraZen! Guess it was way ahead of its time? ;D
Post by: Richdel on January 11, 2013, 12:03:49 PM
Post by: BoldJava on January 15, 2013, 02:11:04 PM
Corgi's prefer Kalitas.
...
Classic stuff -- Korgi's 'n Kettles
Post by: peter on January 15, 2013, 02:38:03 PM
Corgi's prefer Kalitas.
...
Classic stuff -- Korgi's 'n Kettles
Snouts 'n Spouts
Post by: ecc on January 15, 2013, 03:11:17 PM
Corgi's prefer Kalitas.
...
Classic stuff -- Korgi's 'n Kettles
Snouts 'n Spouts
From that photo I think he favors a pulse pour, I would have bet on the higher temp no-paws technique.
Post by: BoldJava on January 24, 2013, 04:22:17 AM
Date Ordered: 1/24/2013
...
Shipping Method: USPS - Priority (2.50lbs.)
Item ID ITEMS PRICE QTY TOTAL
3689 Tiamo 1.2L Stainless Steel Tall Hand Pour Drip Kettle for Pour Over Coffee $75.00
5069-RP Vintage UNRESTORED 2 used 49mm Filter Baskets
Doug and Barb are back open. Pulled the trigger. Won't be here in time for the throwdownhoedown but memory will be fresh enough to give it a good mental "first review comparison." Stay tuned.
Post by: SJM on January 24, 2013, 10:07:37 AM
Troublemaker!
REALLY !!!
45mm-NA OE Aluminum Portafilter Dosing Funnel
1097 Steam Wand Pressure Test Gauge
3144 Silicone Group to Boiler Gasket
Susan
Post by: BoldJava on January 27, 2013, 03:29:52 AM
(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NDAwWDQwMA==/$(KGrHqIOKjoE5YtT6vl9BObhre8B-!~~60_1.JPG?set_id=8800005007)
Post by: BoldJava on January 27, 2013, 08:43:47 AM
It looks similar to the Fino 1 liter kettle that Able ([url]http://ablebrewing.com/collections/products/#fino-pour-over-kettle[/url]) is selling from Japan for $60 (also available in pink).
Cost is a factor in value. I surely loved the Tak but when I compared the pours with the Paico, first thought that comes to mind was, "Is the Tak an $85-better-pour?"
Post by: SJM on January 27, 2013, 08:47:40 AM
Cost is a factor in value. I surely loved the Tak but when I compared the pours with the Paico, first thought that comes to mind was, "Is the Tak an $85-better-pour?"
Amen !!!!
Which is why I'm sticking with the Aroma/Buono combination.
They are here. They are paid for.
No need to mortgage the house for an upgrade.
Susan
Post by: bekeld on January 27, 2013, 10:43:27 AM
Post by: John F on January 27, 2013, 10:58:46 AM
Post by: SJM on January 27, 2013, 11:19:53 AM
How much is the feel worth? Sometimes that alone is worth the cost.
True.
And I would probably be more attuned if pourover were more important here.
I'm an espresso/latte woman at heart.
Pourover is for when all else fails....
Post by: BoldJava on January 27, 2013, 11:25:48 AM
Is it an $85 better pour?I will take a run at it. Call the Takahiro a Mercedes and the Paico a Ford.
Short Answer? Yes, now go by one and forget the rest of the post.
Qualified Answer? Depends...
1) Are you a committed pourover person and know it is a method you plan on working for years?
2) Do you have the extra discretionary shekels?
3) Do you want the best on the market - feel, balance, "hand-presence?"
If so, order one.
On the other hand
1) Interested in learning pourovers? Grab a KONE, Paico and Chemex and have $3.00 left over for your "Takahiro in 2019 Fund."
I didn't find the control issue difference that Peter did but I was racing around, hosting -- maybe I wanted the Paico to perform as well. I could get a liter out of that Takahiro if I monitored the stove. I did notice that rather than boil over through the top, it backed out of the spout when I ran over a liter of fluid in. Also, watch the cap's adjustment. I noticed it falling out for someone.
Post by: John F on January 27, 2013, 11:48:29 AM
I'm a full on pourover fanatic. Daily dedicated pourover for many years. I gave up autodrip with the Clarity and realized no autodrip would ever work for me.
For me it's worth twice the price however I wish it cost half so I could buy 2.
;)
Post by: bekeld on January 27, 2013, 12:01:24 PM
Is it an $85 better pour?For me, the difference is that the Tak pours, and you guide it. The others are poured and guided by the human.
I have focal dystonia in my right hand. I didn't have to work hard at all to get the Tak pour going and to keep it going. For me, pouring is a lot like patting my head and rubbing my belly. Add the dystonia to that and the kettle makes a huge difference. I like the Bonavita, but I am happy to put it down after a 4-minute pour. I am looking forward to giving a test at school this week.
Post by: ecc on January 27, 2013, 07:41:35 PM
Early morning equipment is easily worth an order of magnitude more, think of all the subsequent damage done to the universe later in the day, averted with just the price of a kettle. Baaaargain.
Post by: BoldJava on January 30, 2013, 06:51:39 PM
...but it's a pretty center-based pour leaving a lot of the grounds on the sides under-extracted, I would think.
...
No, water is moving below the cloud and is evenly disbursed throughout the slurry. It is similar to my pour but I don't pulse --
Post by: headchange4u on January 30, 2013, 07:15:06 PM
Post by: peter on January 30, 2013, 07:16:39 PM
Post by: John F on January 30, 2013, 07:25:10 PM
Pretty meticulous filter folding at the beginning,
I do close to the same.
Post by: peter on January 30, 2013, 08:41:00 PM
Pretty meticulous filter folding at the beginning,
I do close to the same.
And it looks like he's pouring with your kettle.
Post by: BoldJava on January 31, 2013, 03:43:22 AM
...
And it looks like he's pouring with your kettle.
No, it's a Bekeld's right now. She was next.
Post by: bekeld on January 31, 2013, 04:21:22 AM
Post by: rasqual on January 31, 2013, 04:46:28 AM
...but it's a pretty center-based pour leaving a lot of the grounds on the sides under-extracted, I would think.
...
No, water is moving below the cloud and is evenly disbursed throughout the slurry. It is similar to my pour but I don't pulse --
What's going on underneath isn't in question. It's those floating grinds to the side of the pour. If someone took the crust off the top and ran it through a further, independent extraction, I'd happily drink the result. There's just no WAY those grinds are getting fully extracted.
Post by: BoldJava on February 01, 2013, 04:18:28 AM
Location Description Date / Time
TROY
ID, 83871
Shipment Accepted January 29, 2013 - 2:37 pm
---
OAK CREEK
WI, 5315
Processed through USPS Sort Facility January 31, 2013 - 9:22 pm
Post by: BoldJava on February 02, 2013, 12:25:11 PM
1st impressions.
1. Man, who thought up this dual arrangement on the handle. Uncomfortable; unnatural feel.
2. Love the wide top. A plus.
3. The thermometer hole in the top doesn't take a standard kitchen frothing thermometer. Orphan sells one that must fit but why not make it a generic application?
4. Top stays on securely.
5. Easily controlled pour, more than what is needed.
6. Love the volume available.
Post by: BoldJava on February 02, 2013, 12:28:28 PM
Extreme control though not as "pointed" as the Takahiro. I found the Paico and Takahiro similar -- the Tiamo seems to offer a very similar amount of control, way more than I believe is needed for a great pourover.
I am going to work with pourovers for the next 10 days or so and give some fuller feedback then.
Tiamo at 11 o'clock; Paico at 8 o'clock.
Post by: peter on February 02, 2013, 12:56:52 PM
Post by: BoldJava on February 10, 2013, 10:01:02 AM
Tiamo 1.2 Liter Kettle (40.5 oz) from Orphan Espresso. (Note: No reimbursement for the product placement - for proportion purposes only except buy Wisconsin beer).
1st impressions.
1. Man, who thought up this dual arrangement on the handle. Uncomfortable; unnatural feel.
2. Love the wide top. A plus.
3. The thermometer hole in the top doesn't take a standard kitchen frothing thermometer. Orphan sells one that must fit but why not make it a generic application?
4. Top stays on securely.
5. Easily controlled pour, more than what is needed.
6. Love the volume available.
Been using the Tiamo for a few days now and thought I would tie up the first look. Good kettle.
^ Enjoying the look on the stove. Czarina votes for the Paico.
^ Love the 1.2 volume. A breeze for making my standard morning demand/supply chart of a liter of coffee.
^ Tiamo has less surface space heating (tall, with narrow base) than the Paico. Takes a few minutes longer to heat the same volume than the Paico. Immaterial to this putzer.
^ Good balance in the kettle. Heavier SS than the Paico.
^ Handle becomes the deal breaker. Really dislike the flat strip arrangement for a handle (compared to the Takahiro).
^ Tip offers a ton of control and more than I need.
Would I buy again? While it is a fine kettle, I would opt for the Paico kettle which now lists at 1.2 liter. I have always maintained it could do 1.2 liters -- now it lists at that size. Out of stock but $24/and about $13 shipping when it returns to stock from Hong Kong. 1/2 the price of the Tiamo for same volume.
http://www.homeloo.com/shop/product_info.php?products_id=574 (http://www.homeloo.com/shop/product_info.php?products_id=574)
Were I to start over on all kettles (knowing what I know now), I would buy a lifetime purchase, a 1.5 liter Takahiro which can be ordered through Prima for nearly $200. Done.
Post by: BoldJava on February 17, 2013, 06:35:16 AM
Hario V60 pourover how-to on Vimeo (http://vimeo.com/11537624)
Post by: John F on February 17, 2013, 06:42:30 AM
Post by: peter on February 17, 2013, 06:52:31 AM
I've done thousands of ride the cloud pours. That method gets my stamp of approval for a no nonsense "need coffee now" pour.
That's similar to my pour too, other than the preinfusion and I ride my cloud up the sides more slowly. That part of the pour should be determined by the flow-rate of the filter, in my opinion.
Post by: bekeld on February 17, 2013, 08:28:30 AM
Post by: ecc on February 17, 2013, 12:20:15 PM
A quick pre-rinse on a brown filter with no dump, no kettle preheat, ultra efficient manpower pour with a lot of water stacking on top seems to be a commercial favorite. I recently timed a newly open boutique shop at just under 1:30 for 12oz on a single hole dripper using a technique very similar to the video.
There are a lot of paths through the extraction countryside. I understand why some prefer the shortest distance between two points, but ...
Rodney Dangerfield Snorts Coffee (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afrC_igjyUQ#ws)
Post by: John F on February 21, 2013, 10:50:23 AM
I actually felt that I liked it the least because with this kettle my pinky was hitting the hot kettle body
My grip has nothing touching the body of the kettle...
Post by: fore on February 22, 2013, 08:06:54 AM
Post by: ecc on February 22, 2013, 09:48:04 AM
I also like to pour it by rotating my forearm, not bending the wrist much, not raising the elbow.
Post by: BozemanEric on February 22, 2013, 10:05:05 AM
Today I split the hot water up amongst the two covered kettles, the Tiamo 700 ml and the Takahiro 900 ml and alternated them on a hot burner to keep the water temp up.
Good idea. If I want two Takahiro kettles I could keep my water temperature up (important at 5000 feet above sea level) and do 20+ ounce pourovers. This was definitely an idea I did not need to hear about.
Post by: John F on February 22, 2013, 10:27:38 AM
Good idea. If I want two Takahiro kettles I could keep my water temperature up (important at 5000 feet above sea level) and do 20+ ounce pourovers.
;D
You just solved B I bigpour's problem.
Two fist fulls of Takahiro. 8)
Post by: BoldJava on February 22, 2013, 12:05:22 PM
I'm only using two kettles for a head-to-head. Didn't think of doing it on a daily. . .
Before the Paico, I used to have the electric kettle in the background, stoked for a refill when the Hario dumped its first contents. You guys laugh -- someday I will drop the double dime for the 1.2L Tak. Watch. Just interested in Jonesing with John.
Post by: John F on February 22, 2013, 02:15:30 PM
That is hysterical. ;D
Post by: BozemanEric on February 22, 2013, 04:19:17 PM
I'm only using two kettles for a head-to-head. Didn't think of doing it on a daily. It would make more sense to have a big water kettle on another burner on the stove and just transfer water from that to the pouring kettle. However, if you need to justify the purchase, then yes I do recommend two pouring kettles. :P
The problem is that water here boils at 203 and I can not handle any water transfer other than from the kettle to the Kone. I usually do a pulse pour and quickly put the kettle back on the stove between pours to keep it at max temp. Even with this this I often struggle to keep it above 195.
With a single pour my water is hitting the grounds sub 200 and this does not account for any cooling from the Kone, V60, or environment.
Post by: BoldJava on March 03, 2013, 01:12:03 PM
My technique in the Kalita 155 ...has been to maintain a fairly high bed of water above the coffee and occasionally maintain it. The decaf drains slowly so it will be finished at 3:30 (including 30 minute bloom)...
Some serious C02 in there.
Post by: peter on March 03, 2013, 01:12:43 PM
Post by: rgrosz78 on March 25, 2013, 06:32:42 PM
We are entering a period of GCBC "club-rush" where everyone reevaluates their kettle and upgrades. We have seen this before: vacpots, levers, shaving schtuff. Kettles are in. "Club-rushes" typically have a life of 5.5 months. Get aboard, be the first on your block to upgrade.Club-rush expiry approaching ... last call ...
Post by: rgrosz78 on March 25, 2013, 07:38:23 PM
I did not show what happens before I start pouring:
1. I use a Saeco electric kettle to heat the water
2. I pre-heat the pouring kettle on the stove with a little water
3. I pre-heat the cone and coffee cup and rinse the filter using the electric kettle
4. I wet the grounds from the electric kettle
5. I empty the pouring kettle and transfer 12-13 ounces of water from the electric kettle to the pouring kettle
Hario Buono with flow restrictor (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdKR6qrsNUA#)
Hario Buono kettle single cup pourover (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GXz1LWgFsE#)
Takahiro kettle single cup pourover (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_1k2864HeE#)
Post by: BoldJava on May 28, 2013, 06:36:39 AM
(http://www.trbimg.com/img/turbine/lat-la-lh-kontextur-watering-can-20130522/920)
Post by: kaotep on May 28, 2013, 08:00:15 AM
Post by: jano on May 28, 2013, 10:09:07 AM
Pipe Dream - NES Gameplay (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQNnJQIPHV4#)
Post by: John F on May 28, 2013, 02:52:34 PM
Post by: ecc on May 28, 2013, 06:43:58 PM
You could always adopt Verve's stance that water temperature isn't that critical ([url]http://blog.vervecoffeeroasters.com/2013/05/08/vcr-street-smarts-13-brew-water-temperature/[/url]), if you're buying that.
I took that a little differently. To me it talked about the importance of preheating, and that a decently sized mass of water covered in the pot it was heated in didn't cool off much in a few minutes.
Post by: Burner0000 on May 29, 2013, 06:29:55 AM
http://www.idrinkcoffee.com/Concept_Art_Pour_Over_Kettle_Pitcher_p/ca-ket.htm (http://www.idrinkcoffee.com/Concept_Art_Pour_Over_Kettle_Pitcher_p/ca-ket.htm)
Post by: John F on May 29, 2013, 07:20:00 AM
Post by: BoldJava on May 29, 2013, 07:22:23 AM
For $30 that looks pretty good.
Open top -- heat loss?
Post by: John F on May 29, 2013, 07:31:40 AM
For some reason I think kettles are not viewed like other coffee gear when it comes to price/performance. I bet you can get more than $30 worth of pour out of that thing.
It won't touch the top kettles but it's under a third of the price.
Post by: ecc on May 29, 2013, 07:34:08 AM
Post by: John F on May 29, 2013, 07:37:58 AM
Post by: Burner0000 on May 29, 2013, 07:47:48 AM
Post by: John F on May 29, 2013, 07:56:45 AM
I will constantly be refilling it so heat loss won't really be an issue.
It won't be. Until it is and then it will be.
I see the kettle progression the same as the espresso machine progression. Every body starts somewhere and stops where the feel comfortable.
Post by: BoldJava on October 12, 2013, 03:27:03 AM
I have been playing with the Kalita Pelican for a month now.
Upside?
1. Blends perfectly with the red accent the Czarina has created in our remodeled kitchen. Don't disregard fashion over function (utilitarians grimace in unison at this juncture). Lots of points. Kettle gets displayed and contributes to the accent.
2. Great pouring tip. Easily controlled slow stream.
Downside?
1. Kettle is just a hair short (1 oz maybe?) of what I like to work with.
2. Top has no out-lip and the top falls off when you reach the end of the pouring. Easily resolved with a set of pliers and a cloth but I am always amazed how items are designed and produced without attention to this kind of detail. Doesn't anyone use the prototypes?
3. Protruding neck clanks into the edge of the Chemex (again, design issue). Remedied by lifting the kettle higher and pouring.
4. On occasion, last 2 oz need swishing to have them line up with the inner chamber holes. Comes in a rush.
Recommended? No, unless fashion trumps function. My 3-some will remain in tact as the display factor merits it. It is nice to have multiple kettles in rotation when we are cupping so one is always ready to go for the next coffee to be evaluated.
Post by: peter on October 12, 2013, 09:52:06 AM
My, my, my,
How helpful am I?
Post by: BoldJava on October 12, 2013, 09:53:29 AM
A can of red spray paint for the Tiamo and the Paico will keep the Czarina happy, and then you could peddle the Pelican.
My, my, my,
How helpful am I?
The caffeine is clearly helping your wit. Drink more.
Post by: Aromajunkie on October 12, 2013, 03:17:17 PM
I think a titanium oxynitride coating would look nice.
([url]http://rchobbies.com.au/store/images/HPZ659.jpg[/url])
Post by: BoldJava on December 07, 2013, 06:20:47 AM
And no, I didn't buy one. Full up on kettles.
I couldn't find ECC's post -- did it have the 1.5L?
Post by: BozemanEric on December 12, 2013, 07:32:19 PM
Post by: BoldJava on December 13, 2013, 03:26:51 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zHatJdIgAG8#t=119 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zHatJdIgAG8#t=119)
Post by: peter on December 13, 2013, 08:18:49 AM
Post by: BoldJava on December 13, 2013, 08:37:26 AM
...That was the idea that lead to my still-unsurpassed and brilliant cotter-pin mod. 8)
I have a great deal of respect for you but that has to be one of the most subjective opinions I have ever seen you render <w/>.
Post by: peter on December 13, 2013, 09:46:45 AM
Post by: rgrosz78 on December 13, 2013, 11:06:49 AM
Why I love this group - you two are Great Entertainers ::)...That was the idea that lead to my still-unsurpassed and brilliant cotter-pin mod. 8)
I have a great deal of respect for you but that has to be one of the most subjective opinions I have ever seen you render <w/>.
Post by: peter on December 13, 2013, 12:33:45 PM
Peter,
I think that the cotter pin mod deserves a kickstarter to fund a project to get these cotter pins out to the public.
What if you dribbled water down a clean soldering iron instead of a chopstick? You'd heat the water at the same time as your pouring, maintaining good temps. You might have to PID that soldering iron to make sure you don't overheat the coffee bed.
I like how you think yakman! Your brain probably works like mine; not much is original, but it does well taking the idea of another person and tweaking it.
Post by: John F on December 13, 2013, 07:24:03 PM
I don't know what he was saying but I know exactly what he was saying.
Post by: BoldJava on December 13, 2013, 08:33:45 PM
I like that chopstick guy. 8)
I don't know what he was saying but I know exactly what he was saying.
Hai, http://japanese.about.com/library/media/audio/sjp4-1.mp3 (http://japanese.about.com/library/media/audio/sjp4-1.mp3)
Post by: jimbo on December 21, 2013, 02:40:54 PM
Post by: BoldJava on February 06, 2014, 01:26:05 AM
http://www.orphanespresso.com/search.asp?keyword=kettle&search=Find (http://www.orphanespresso.com/search.asp?keyword=kettle&search=Find)
Post by: John F on February 06, 2014, 10:44:44 AM
Post by: BoldJava on March 10, 2014, 05:21:38 PM
http://www.amazon.com/Kalita-Tea-Coffee-Kettle-Wave/dp/B000X12JDC (http://www.amazon.com/Kalita-Tea-Coffee-Kettle-Wave/dp/B000X12JDC)
Post by: BoldJava on May 03, 2014, 05:14:33 AM
Not yet available on the retail scene.
Post by: sonnyhad on May 05, 2014, 12:55:25 PM
Post by: John F on May 05, 2014, 07:15:56 PM
You don't drive those huge dual wheel trucks do you? ;D
Post by: Intrepid510 on July 23, 2014, 11:05:20 AM
Is there a kettle that is designed to not do this?
Found my answer. Thank you.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk 2
Post by: peter on July 23, 2014, 12:30:08 PM
Post by: rgrosz78 on July 23, 2014, 06:23:42 PM
Is there a kettle that is designed to not do this?Inquiring minds want to know - what was your solution?
Found my answer. Thank you.
Post by: century on July 23, 2014, 06:27:03 PM
Is there a kettle that is designed to not do this?Inquiring minds want to know - what was your solution?
Found my answer. Thank you.
Me also.
I hate it when it dribbles out and hits the side of the filter ! >:( :D
Post by: John F on July 23, 2014, 09:05:08 PM
Post by: Intrepid510 on July 24, 2014, 08:45:13 AM
Or at least thats what i came up after going through this thread and the tak roadshow. However there are a few kalitta pots on amazon for about fifty that are tempting.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk 2
Post by: century on July 24, 2014, 10:21:31 AM
You can tweak the spout with a needle nose pliers.
Is there a specific way to tweak it or just give a squeeze from the side?
Post by: peter on July 24, 2014, 10:41:54 AM
You can tweak the spout with a needle nose pliers.
Is there a specific way to tweak it or just give a squeeze from the side?
Just squeeze it from the sides, to form a narrower/sharper point. Squeeze it further than you think. Then try pouring some water. Rinse. Repeat.
I actually added a very thin piece of wire, something like a thin paper clip to my spout. Bend it and crimp it so both legs are touching along their entire length, then shove that onto the spout with maybe 1/8" sticking out. The water will dribble off of that very cleanly, in the teeniest stream you could want.
Waaaaay better than a Takahiro. :o
Post by: John F on July 24, 2014, 10:55:28 AM
Post by: BoldJava on July 24, 2014, 11:02:52 AM
Can somebody go perform a wellness check on Peter? ???
He was fine when he was here or as fine as he gets <grins>.
He is a creature of improve what you have.
Post by: Tourman on July 24, 2014, 11:15:55 AM
Quote
I actually added a very thin piece of wire, something like a thin paper clip to my spout. Bend it and crimp it so both legs are touching along their entire length, then shove that onto the spout with maybe 1/8" sticking out. The water will dribble off of that very cleanly, in the teeniest stream you could want.
Are we talking enlarged prostate problems here?? <ouch>
Post by: BoldJava on July 24, 2014, 11:21:46 AM
Post by: peter on July 24, 2014, 01:45:59 PM
Just so youse guys don't start photoshopping me in ways I don't care to be photoshopped.
Post by: rgrosz78 on August 26, 2014, 06:04:46 AM
http://www.amazon.com/Hario-VKB-100HSV-Bouno-Coffee-Kettle/dp/B008L3R8BM (http://www.amazon.com/Hario-VKB-100HSV-Bouno-Coffee-Kettle/dp/B008L3R8BM)
Post by: jano on August 26, 2014, 07:02:34 AM
:P