Coffee Crafters Artisan 6 fluid bed roaster

[aaronranson]

After having the roaster for a good period of time now, are there any insights you have? I currently have a 1# Sono and am thinking about adding a 2# Sono but am also looking at the Artisan 6. I will be doing commercial roasting up to 100# a week.

[kjr55w]

I am still very happy with  this roaster. It is very simple, efficient, and well made. I have done about 160 roasts, usually 1500g (3.3lb green) and do 3-5 back to back roasts in 1.5 to 2 hrs. The bean cooler is a pleasure to use (about 1.5  min). Have smoothed the curves out ( Rao) and try to eliminate the plateau after first crack and the increasing ROR subsequent to that by agressive use of heat and fan (spouting bed). I have 3 phase power and am only getting 210v at the outlet. Try to get the full 240 for larger roasts. The newest roasters are modularized (separate chafe collector)

[aaronranson]

Thank you for the update KJ

[Ascholten]

I am definately going to get one of these, just have to get calmed down here a bit.
So much stuff happening all at once on me, my life is a tornado now and every damned day I wake up, I wonder which way I am going to be blown / dragged next :X

Mine will be in the garage, I am seriously thinking I don't need a cooler / chaff collector.  Let it blow outside.  I can hook up a fan if the unit's fan don't do it and just huff it right outside.  A bean cooler I am thinking I can make with a vacuum and a 5 gallon can and colander.  you have to move the beans anyways in this thing to cool them right?  I am thinking one of those 30 dollar 5 gallon bucket head vacs and a mesh screen and I have a pretty nifty cooler.  I'll redneck enguneers it

Aaron

[zar]

Hello everybody.  This is my first post here, I found this thread while trying to "troubleshoot" my experience with an Artisan Roaster.  Apologies for bumping an old thread in advance if that's frowned upon.  I've been roasting coffee for about a year.  I started off on a Behmor and was able to get a decent roast out of it and used it for about 6 months.  I had some cash to spare towards the end of the year so I went in on an Artisan 2.5 from Coffee Crafters.  I know it's not exactly the same thing, but close enough, I reckon? 

Thing is, I haven't been able to roast anything as "good" as what I could get on my Behmor.  I understand there are far more variables with this machine vs. the Behmor, but I'm running in to the same problems over and over.  The issue is, my beans all end up tasting dull, bland, grassy and have similar aroma.  I typically try to roast up to 2nd crack or about 30 seconds into 2nd crack max.  I don't have anything charted, but I did discover I was roasting too hot/too fast (was getting some funky looking beans).  Since paying more attention to temp, I have been getting a more consistent looking bean (similar to what's pictured on page 3 of this thread) but have really only gotten about one decent batch out of many.  I've been trying to get to 300 degrees at 5 minutes and first crack within the next 5 minutes.  I've noticed I've been getting to 1c by as early as 8.5. 

Can anyone help point me in the right direction?  I don't think it's a hardware issue, I'm willing to bet it's a user error.  I think I've narrowed it down to bean loft height compared to my batch size (so far I've averaged about 1.5 pounds per batch) but it's hard to say if it's too high or too low. 

[Ascholten]

Hello Zar and welcome to the GCBC.  Nope, we are not mad at bumping threads up, we do it all the time.

It sounds to me like you are heating the beans up too fast initially.  That roaster can pour some energy into the beans and also, fluid bed roasters don't need to go 18 minutes to roast, Ive seen plenty of roasts that come out excellent at 8 minutes or so.  Taking them into second crack, that right there is killing a lot of the flavor off.  In second crack you are basically burning off the origins of the beans flavor and caramelizing everything.

How much at a shot are you roasting?  What wattage you putting it at?  Try to keep the temperature increase about a degree every few seconds and you should be fine.  Don't panic if it's a little bit fast on initial startup but by 200 degrees you should have the temp ramp rate about where you want it.

Aaron

[zar]

Thanks Ascholten.  I've been averaging about 1.5 pounds (enough for me to get through the week and to give a little to family to sample) but I've done as little as 1 and as much as 2.5.  The Artisan 2.5 doesn't have the same wattage setting that the 6 does, but more of a generic power/heat level setting (I think this can be translated but I can't access the manual at the moment).  But I've been roasting at "7" (out of 10). 

If getting to second crack is indeed my problem, would it be advisable to cut the heat after 2nd crack and let the beans run at around 300 degrees for a few minutes?  Or am I reading too much into this?

[Ascholten]

7 of 10 sounds a bit hot.  Try 5 and see how that works for you and adjust up slightly from there.  You can roast down to half a pound easy on that machine I am betting so while you tinker you can do in smaller batches so if it turns out not too nice, you didn't use a bunch of greens to do that.
Second crack, you are taking it too deep into it.  Many coffee's you really want to keep in first, or just barely touching second.  Once you hit second you have to have your game on because the coffee can get away from you very fast and go into 3rd crack (start on fire, NOT fun).  You can generally tell when you are approaching second, there will be a bit of smoke, well more than from first, and it will smell very acrid, you may hear a few feint snaps too.  Turn off heat and cool at that point see how it works for you.

Aaron

[zar]

Thanks, Aaron, sound advice for sure!

[Java Girl]

I used the Sonofresco for years. I still have it but I did buy the Artisan 2.5 I LOVE IT. It’s simpler and faster. You do have to watch it every minute though unlike the Sonofresco which has the computer program.

[Ascholten]

Java Girl.  Glad to hear you like the machine that well.  Ive been saying for a bit they are great roasters.
I do have to say to you though, you mentioned, you have to watch it every minute.  You should do that with ANY coffee roaster.  Never walk away from a roaster that is active.  It is way too easy to start fires in any roaster, (trust me, I even managed in an I roast) and if you are not there when that happens, you could be in serious trouble.

Seriously though, walking away from a roast in process is a very bad idea no matter what from a safety perspective.
I have actually purposely pushed coffee to the flame point on every roaster I own, I did this because I needed to see when it happens, ie what stage, warning signs im getting there and most importantly how the machine reacts to that event.  Especially considering the Artisan is a fluid bed with insane power, I needed to see if I was going to turn the thing into a fireball sprinkler or what if it ever caught on fire.  That makes a big difference between if I just sit there with a small hand held extinguisher or arm the Halon system I have in my garage.

The Artisan IS simpler if you just want to roast and go but it also has every capability of being very complex if you want to experiment as well.  I have also purposely held coffee right on the verge of crack (turn heat down and let it soak for about 45 seconds) for development and then pushed it through.  That's hard to do on most other machines, they either don't give you that kind of control on temperature, or are slower to react to temp changes because they are running at almost 100 percent capacity heatwise.

I have also used my Artisan to roast cocoa beans too.  Totally different experience there and Id recommend a stainless colendar to put on top of the roast chamber because of the nature of cocoa, you need a ton of loft to circulate them right and if one gets caught right it'll throw it into the neighbors yard, so you need a better containment for cocoa beans.  the stainless colendar also works wonders too if you are roasting over rated capacity.  I have put 8 lbs into mine at a shot.  I have the artisan 6.  The limiting factor believe it or not is NOT the heat input, it's the physical space in the roasting funnel.  The beans get too close to the top and they'll start slopping over and out, but a colendar on top works wonders.

Also FWIW,  I was only running 8800 Watts to roast 7.5 Lb of greens on my Artisan 6.  Running full bore the thing can put out a teensy bit under 11 KW.

Aaron

[Java Girl]

Ascholten, I agree absolutely. NEVER walk away from your roaster. AND have one or two fire extinguishers in the room. The feature on the Sonofresco is that you can set your program and monitor it while doing something else in the room. Label your bag, create and invoice, read these threads, etc. As long as you’re not easily distracted it’s ok. Always watch the end of the roast intently. (After all Fahrenheit 451 is the point at which paper burns).


Java Girl.  Glad to hear you like the machine that well.  Ive been saying for a bit they are great roasters.
I do have to say to you though, you mentioned, you have to watch it every minute.  You should do that with ANY coffee roaster.  Never walk away from a roaster that is active.  It is way too easy to start fires in any roaster, (trust me, I even managed in an I roast) and if you are not there when that happens, you could be in serious trouble.

Seriously though, walking away from a roast in process is a very bad idea no matter what from a safety perspective.
I have actually purposely pushed coffee to the flame point on every roaster I own, I did this because I needed to see when it happens, ie what stage, warning signs im getting there and most importantly how the machine reacts to that event.  Especially considering the Artisan is a fluid bed with insane power, I needed to see if I was going to turn the thing into a fireball sprinkler or what if it ever caught on fire.  That makes a big difference between if I just sit there with a small hand held extinguisher or arm the Halon system I have in my garage.

The Artisan IS simpler if you just want to roast and go but it also has every capability of being very complex if you want to experiment as well.  I have also purposely held coffee right on the verge of crack (turn heat down and let it soak for about 45 seconds) for development and then pushed it through.  That's hard to do on most other machines, they either don't give you that kind of control on temperature, or are slower to react to temp changes because they are running at almost 100 percent capacity heatwise.

I have also used my Artisan to roast cocoa beans too.  Totally different experience there and Id recommend a stainless colendar to put on top of the roast chamber because of the nature of cocoa, you need a ton of loft to circulate them right and if one gets caught right it'll throw it into the neighbors yard, so you need a better containment for cocoa beans.  the stainless colendar also works wonders too if you are roasting over rated capacity.  I have put 8 lbs into mine at a shot.  I have the artisan 6.  The limiting factor believe it or not is NOT the heat input, it's the physical space in the roasting funnel.  The beans get too close to the top and they'll start slopping over and out, but a colendar on top works wonders.

Also FWIW,  I was only running 8800 Watts to roast 7.5 Lb of greens on my Artisan 6.  Running full bore the thing can put out a teensy bit under 11 KW.

Aaron
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[Ascholten]

Let me tag this real quick.
They no longer offer the 6  but have a 9 Lb roaster which uses the same amount of power,  that's a good thing, and a smaller  3.5 lb version.  Still great roasters, ive been using the heck out of mine and almost no issues with it at all.  I think I had to replace 1 .. 3 dollar switch. 

Aaron

[compaddict]

After seven years roasting with my Behmor I just pulled the trigger on a Artisan 3e!
I have been looking at them for a few years.. Two or three years ago Coffee Crafters were kind enough to roast a sample for me with a bean I was very Familiar with. Quite a step up with much more complex flavors.
Parts will be here Wednesday, then off to learning all over again!
Vince

[brianmch]

Keep us posted how it goes with your new toy.

It'll be more similar to your Behmor than a gas drum roaster would be, which operates in an opposite manner. 

There are only a few roasters in this capacity range.