Green Coffee Buying Club

Coffee Discussion boards => Hardware & Equipment => Topic started by: grinderz on May 09, 2011, 11:27:49 PM

Title: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: grinderz on May 09, 2011, 11:27:49 PM: My PM at work is ready to plop down some $$ on an espresso machine and grinder and has been asking for advice. His budget is in the $3000+ range. If you were going to spend this kind of money today what would y'all choose and why? One of his criteria is size and esthetics so a commercial sized grinder is not going to work for him, BTW.
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: Tex on May 10, 2011, 12:25:02 AM: Let's hope the buyer learns to love the looks of Macap, Mazzer, or other commercial espresso grinder. I tell folks the espresso machine is an accessory to the grinder, and that they should buy accordingly.

With that budget I'd recommend this Palanca (or similar lever machine) (http://www.orphanespresso.com/Gaggia-Italcrem-Single-Group-Vintage-Espresso-Machine_p_3876.html) and a commercial grinder - my personal favorite is the Rancilio MD50. This combo would satisfy the most demanding home barista.
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: BoldJava on May 10, 2011, 03:43:55 AM: Quote from: Tex on May 10, 2011, 12:25:02 AM
...
With that budget I'd recommend this Palanca (or similar lever machine) ([url]http://www.orphanespresso.com/Gaggia-Italcrem-Single-Group-Vintage-Espresso-Machine_p_3876.html[/url]) and a commercial grinder ...

<Chuckles>. You have no idea how many times I looked at that one, stopping just short of measuring the kitchen. It's really not that big.

RE: Espresso machine at work -- will you get stuck being the barista? I can see that as a time sink. Amateur hour if everyone pulls their own.

B|Java
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: peter on May 10, 2011, 08:19:36 AM: Most of you know what I'd be recommending. For ease of use, pretty much bullet-proof, ready to play out of the box, not to mention excellent and repeatable shots, the Vivaldi was at the top of my list and worth your consideration. If size of the grinder is important, the Baratza Vario will work well.

But you haven't given us enough details on how/where the machine will be used to give you much of an answer.
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: milowebailey on May 10, 2011, 08:39:57 AM: GS-3 and find a used grinder... ~$4500
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: Tex on May 10, 2011, 08:40:21 AM: Quote from: peter on May 10, 2011, 08:19:36 AM
Most of you know what I'd be recommending. For ease of use, pretty much bullet-proof, ready to play out of the box, not to mention excellent and repeatable shots, the Vivaldi was at the top of my list and worth your consideration. If size of the grinder is important, the Baratza Vario will work well.

But you haven't given us enough details on how/where the machine will be used to give you much of an answer.

Spoken like a quantum ~~physicist~~ mechanic!
cartoon treat the lever (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDfOzs28XyI#)
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: grinderz on May 10, 2011, 09:08:14 AM: I could have been more specific on the size thing... he's looking at a Macap M4 - said a Super Jolly was too big :)
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: Tex on May 10, 2011, 09:13:09 AM: Quote from: grinderz on May 10, 2011, 09:08:14 AM
I could have been more specific on the size thing... he's looking at a Macap M4 - said a Super Jolly was too big :)

Too messy for a work place - push for a K-cup machine with refillable cartridges.
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: grinderz on May 10, 2011, 08:09:04 PM: It's for his kitchen, not here at work...
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: Tex on May 10, 2011, 09:29:31 PM: Quote from: grinderz on May 10, 2011, 08:09:04 PM
It's for his kitchen, not here at work...

OK then; M4 & Vivaldi. Not quite top of the line, but close enough you'll make browny points for recommending them.
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: grinderz on May 10, 2011, 09:40:52 PM: I talked to my co-worker today and now he's got his cap set on a Vibiemme Domobar Junior in the PID'ed double boiler flavor. Anybody have anything good or bad to say about them?

(http://www.1st-line.com/images/vibiemme/jr_db.jpg) (http://www.1st-line.com/machines/comm_mod/esprmach/vibiemme/index.htm)
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: randytsuch on May 10, 2011, 10:18:45 PM: I have seen posts about issues with the double jr and temperature drifting after an hour or so.

It appears that the steam boiler temp effect the brew boiler after long periods of time, but the PID should fix this.

PID's are only available as an aftermarket add on for the jr, they are not factory installed.

Seems like he could get the full size Vib double for his budget, it looks to be a very nice machine.

Randy
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: mp on May 11, 2011, 02:35:38 AM: Quote from: randytsuch on May 10, 2011, 10:18:45 PM
I have seen posts about issues with the double jr and temperature drifting after an hour or so.

It appears that the steam boiler temp effect the brew boiler after long periods of time, but the PID should fix this.

PID's are only available as an aftermarket add on for the jr, they are not factory installed.

Seems like he could get the full size Vib double for his budget, it looks to be a very nice machine.

Randy

+1

Some ex Faema guys went out and started Vibiemme. Supposedly the E64 group is the same size and weight as the original Faema.

:)
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: expy98 on May 11, 2011, 02:20:27 PM: I have the VBM Jr Double Boiler and recently added a PID to it.
W/out the PID, there's no such thing as temp stability. Fortunately
the PID kit is easy and cheap (under $200). You might want to read the
thread on HB. Once PIDed, its temp behavior is same as any other PID
E61 double boilers.

Other than that, due to its smaller steam boiler compared to any HXs,
the steam can't vigorously roll more than 6oz of milk at a time. But the steam
boiler will reach full capacity again quickly, maybe 15 or 20 secs, ready to
do another 6oz batch.

If counter space is not an issue, I agree, spend a little more and get
the full sized PID double boiler or Vivaldi.
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: Tex on May 11, 2011, 02:31:08 PM: Quote from: expy98 on May 11, 2011, 02:20:27 PM
I have the VBM Jr Double Boiler and recently added a PID to it.
W/out the PID, there's no such thing as temp stability. Fortunately
the PID kit is easy and cheap (under $200). You might want to read the
thread on HB. Once PIDed, its temp behavior is same as any other PID
E61 double boilers.

Other than that, due to its smaller steam boiler compared to any HXs,
the steam can't vigorously roll more than 6oz of milk at a time. But the steam
boiler will reach full capacity again quickly, maybe 15 or 20 secs, ready to
do another 6oz batch.

If counter space is not an issue, I agree, spend a little more and get
the full sized PID double boiler or Vivaldi.

Really? Wow! A Gaggia can do more than tat after it's been PID'd. How big is the steam boiler?
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: northwestmark on May 11, 2011, 03:19:01 PM: I can get you a brand new GS/3 for around $4700 delivered.

Mark
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: Tex on May 11, 2011, 03:38:55 PM: Quote from: northwestmark on May 11, 2011, 03:19:01 PM
I can get you a brand new GS/3 for around $4700 delivered.

Mark

I'm not listening! I have two more machines to rebuild, then I'm pulling the trigger on a new machine. Lever/GS3; GS3/lever? I've got a lead on a 1-group Visacrem like Danny used. I just have to get it from Europe & rebuild it!

(http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20070203102017/http://www.danny.mcnulty.btinternet.co.uk/gaggia.jpg)
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: BoldJava on July 07, 2014, 04:51:32 AM: Milo mentioned the GS-3. Had to post this pic of wood made for side panels. Dave Stephens, Cannonfodder, at H-B makes all kinds of wood toys for coffee.

Luscious.
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: GC7 on July 07, 2014, 11:41:53 AM: Dave/Cannonfodder does great work.

My QM Anita is decked out in Amboyna Burl knobs, brew handle, portafilter and tamper and I got a 7/8 Wade and Butcher for Barbers use straight razor from him with ironwood burl scales.

I'm curious if this work espresso experiment ever started and how sucessful it turned out. Here at work I brought in a Capresso burr grinder, clever dripper, filters, a Pino Kettle and home roast and everyone was too lazy to use it. I gave up and let them purchase the dregs from the coffee shop on the main level of the building.

or - my coffee sucks :o
Title: Re: $3-4K to spend. Which espresso machine and grinder do you choose?
Post by: vesteroid on July 11, 2014, 08:35:44 PM: Well a plug for what I own, a rocket r58 and a k10....I like it anyway :)