ExtractMoJo.

[John F]

I cannot tell you how the unit takes the TDS of water into consideration.  That would be a question that Vince could answer.  His email address is vince@terriorcoffee.com.

You misunderstood.

I have a TDS meter and if I check my water, your water, bottled water, RO water, Etc, etc.. they all have vastly different TDS readings.

How do you account for the TDS of the water you are using when you are shooting for a specific TDS in your coffee?

If you are not measuring your water and accounting for it from sample to sample you can see how shooting for X# in a cup of coffee has now become meaningless.  

And further the ratios of those numbers also needs to be known.... That is what I was talking about.

But you might be accounting for all of that, I don't know...just asking and illustrating the idea there is more to TDS than reading it and knowing what is in a cup of coffee or if it will taste good/better just because of a reading

[MoreForYourCup]

I understand what you're saying.  Unfortunately, I am not knowledgeable enough to give you an explaination.  What I will do is ask Vince for an explanation, and I'll post it whenever I get it.  He's had good answers for every question I've ever asked.

Take care,

James

[John F]

Good deal, and I can anticipate what the answer will be.

It will be to use water that meets SCAA standards. 

[MoreForYourCup]

Good deal, and I can anticipate what the answer will be.

It will be to use water that meets SCAA standards. 

Oh, John.  You're killing me.  But you probably already knew that.

Talk to you soon,

James

[John F]

Oh, John.  You're killing me.  

Don't let it bother you really and you don't need to ask him unless you want to know.

I already know what I know and what I need to know to know what I need.  



Here is what you are supposed to be using by the way to maximize your Mojo'ing.  


 

The brewing water should have these characteristics:
Characteristic
Target
Acceptable Range
Odor 1
Clean / Fresh, Odor free
Color 2
Clear color
Total Chlorine
O mg/L
TDS 3
150 mg/L
75 - 250 mg/L
Calcium Hardness
4 grains or 68 mg/L
1 - 5 grains or 17 mg/L - 85 mg/L
Total Alkalinity
40 mg/L
At or near 40 mg/L
pH
7.0
6.5 to 7.5
Sodium
10 mg/L
At or near 10 mg/

[MoreForYourCup]

Oh, John.  You're killing me. 

Don't let it bother you really and you don't need to ask him unless you want to know.

I already know what I know and what I need to know to know what I need. 



Here is what you are supposed to be using by the way. 




The brewing water should have these characteristics:
Characteristic
Target
Acceptable Range
Odor 1
Clean / Fresh, Odor free
Color 2
Clear color
Total Chlorine
O mg/L
TDS 3
150 mg/L
75 - 250 mg/L
Calcium Hardness
4 grains or 68 mg/L
1 - 5 grains or 17 mg/L - 85 mg/L
Total Alkalinity
40 mg/L
At or near 40 mg/L
pH
7.0
6.5 to 7.5
Sodium
10 mg/L
At or near 10 mg/

Great.  Now I need to buy another meter.  Can I write you a check?

[John F]

Great.  Now I need to buy another meter.  Can I write you a check?

Nope...info is free and there are deep holes all over this place one could fall into.

Have fun with it.

[staylor]

I would like to play with one, ever since it popped up onto the radar it's looked interesting. Having said that, it would probably be more of a curiosity and neato widget rather than something I would use on a daily or even weekly basis. The price is prohibitive but if someone let me trial is for 30days I would take it on. Maybe it would be so useful I would want to buy one??? Somehow I doubt it because for espresso things kind of look like this for me:

ShaunMoJo

- Software portion: My brain and a few years of experience.
- Hardware portion: My hands, controlled by the software portion.
- Super secret proprietary portion: Intuition.

For other extraction methods it kind of looks the same as the espresso model, except the software version for other methods isn't as sophisticated.

I've tasted cups that were brewed to the SCAA standard and some of them weren't that good, so the SCAA standard is no guarantee of enjoyment for me and the others that were around me. How does any software/hardware interface that comes in a cardboard box know 'what's right' for a coffee? It's a general guideline but it has to stop there... as a guideline. Unless of course the cardboard contents were designed by Cyberdyne systems and the contents are patiently waiting to become self-aware in the near future so they can take into account all obscure variables including the unique individuals taste receptors and how that is processed at a neural level, then possibly morph into Skynet. If it can do that... cool, I'll grab my VISA right now!

I'm not purposely running the ExtractMoJo down but unless the price was adjusted by a large amount I don't see it in my future. However... if someone is positive I need this I'll gladly provide my mailing address for the complimentary delivery. ;-)

[John F]

- Software portion: My brain and a few years of experience.
- Hardware portion: My hands, controlled by the software portion.
- Super secret proprietary portion: Intuition.

Amen.

[ecc]

But I love my Brix meter.  Objective, well reasoned things give me confidence ...

[slowhand]

  Staylor may be on to something. I say we start forming the Resistance now.

[MoreForYourCup]

I would like to play with one, ever since it popped up onto the radar it's looked interesting. Having said that, it would probably be more of a curiosity and neato widget rather than something I would use on a daily or even weekly basis. The price is prohibitive but if someone let me trial is for 30days I would take it on. Maybe it would be so useful I would want to buy one??? Somehow I doubt it because for espresso things kind of look like this for me:

ShaunMoJo

- Software portion: My brain and a few years of experience.
- Hardware portion: My hands, controlled by the software portion.
- Super secret proprietary portion: Intuition.

For other extraction methods it kind of looks the same as the espresso model, except the software version for other methods isn't as sophisticated.

I've tasted cups that were brewed to the SCAA standard and some of them weren't that good, so the SCAA standard is no guarantee of enjoyment for me and the others that were around me. How does any software/hardware interface that comes in a cardboard box know 'what's right' for a coffee? It's a general guideline but it has to stop there... as a guideline. Unless of course the cardboard contents were designed by Cyberdyne systems and the contents are patiently waiting to become self-aware in the near future so they can take into account all obscure variables including the unique individuals taste receptors and how that is processed at a neural level, then possibly morph into Skynet. If it can do that... cool, I'll grab my VISA right now!

I'm not purposely running the ExtractMoJo down but unless the price was adjusted by a large amount I don't see it in my future. However... if someone is positive I need this I'll gladly provide my mailing address for the complimentary delivery. ;-)

Shaun

If you are experienced and you know what you're doing, you probably don't need ExtractMoJo.   For me, it's been a tremedous help, simply because I don't have the years of experience behind me.  One of the biggest issues I have encountered is getting the right coffee/water ratio. It seems that everybody has their own opinion regarding how much coffee to use, so that left me with trial and error to work with.  I've even visited some of the 'big boys' of coffee, and they were updosing 10-15 grams.  I tried using their recipe, and it was horrible.  Maybe they updosed in order to get a shorter brewing time, but it simply did not work for me. 

I may lack a considerable amount of experience, but my passion for coffee runs high.  If I'm selling a $20/pound bag of Kenyan coffee, I want to make sure that my customer tastes the great flavors and is as blown away from it as I am.  ExtractMoJo has helped me get to that point.  I can brew coffee without it now, but I have found that not all coffees brew the same.  For some, I will have to grind a bit finer, others, a bit courser.  As John said earlier, it is no silver bullet, but it has been a tremendous help for me.

Please understand that if I test a coffee sample, and it's above or below the targeted 1.3%TDS, I don't throw it out and start all over, unless it's way over or under.  I simply use it as a guide, and as I have said before, it has been the one tool that's helped improve the quality of my brewing technique and the finished product.

It also looks like there is a new app for the IPhone, it's called ExtractMoJoToGo.  So now, people don't have to sit in front of their computer to be able to use the software.  Fortunately, the computer version works just fine for me, especially since I don't own an IPhone.

James

[crholliday]

Good deal, and I can anticipate what the answer will be.

It will be to use water that meets SCAA standards. 

I dont think water TDS is going to move the refractometer or EM's calculations at all:

Typical tap water is between 100 ppm and 400 ppm. EPA toxicity standards require levels below 500 ppm. That would be between 0.01% TDS and 0.04% TDS. If we assume some semblance of acceptable water due to the detail-oriented nature of most folks involved in this discussion, water TDS variants are going to be insignificant in these calculations.

[staylor]

Hey James,

Understood. I was just trying to ease us back from the edge of "But one thing I do know, is that anyone who cares enough about quality coffee should have it.  After using mine, I cannot imagine not having it." As they say, the truth lies somewhere in the middle and I suspect a lot of people would benefit from this tool but some not so much.

The problem as I see it is the people who would benefit the most from ExtractMoJo are people just starting down the coffee path (of course that path never ends) but typically the newish coffee converts are the hardest to part with their money. They came from Folgers in a can and a kettle, a months worth of coffee for $1.27, then someone convinces then they have to buy a bag of 'boutique' beans and it seems unreasonably expensive, then someone tells them they need to drop several hundred dollars on a science kit. From Folgers to just under a G note... and that's why ExtractMoJo has a disconnect.

[slowhand]

   John Connor, are you out there?